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I got pwned by my cloud costs

troyhunt.com

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Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#401

Post by 300bps »

pdimitar wrote: post #383
bluedino wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if the disk on a $40 Hetzner server would be fast/big enough for him. All the searching and storing of massive password hash collections. He has a writeup here on how he gets costs down in a big way: https://www.troyhunt.com/serverless-to-the-max-doing-big-thi...

I tried to scan through the linked article (and OP) but couldn't quite figure out Troy's storage requirements. Are they really massive? The sum of the GB figured shown in the OP doesn't even amount to 200GB AFAICT. But even if it's something like 10TB that's still not super expensive on many hosting providers.

The math says it was 25 TB per day for a month.

($350 per day at .014 per GB)

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#402

Post by BenjiWiebe »

gkhartman wrote: post #25
iso1631 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Get a VPS from linode for $5 a month and it costs $5 a month.

They have transfer limits and an associated overage fee iirc. I can still see this sort of thing happening if that is the case.

I barely even realized that, since my hobby stuff doesn't come anywhere near the limit.

For those curious, the overage rate is $10/TB ($0.01/GB) after the transfer included in the plan.

The smallest amount of included transfer is 1TB for the $5/mo VPS.

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#403

Post by pdimitar »

api wrote: post #362
brodouevencode wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everything is more complex to debug, more expensive, and more shitty in all the possible ways you can imagine. Coming from traditional infrastructure and development methods, you're mostly right. Part of the expectation of the cloud is that you do things _their way_. And even then each cloud provider does things a little differently. However, if you're willing to subscribe to the way of doing things it (and you'll…

> networking setup is free/cheap/doesn't require a Cisco cert. you can trust a developer to set things up. Bare metal hosts set up the network for you. You may need to know how to configure a local network interface. Even if you actually rack and stack many colos will give you a drop with network set up. You don't need to do what you describe unless you are building your own DC. > object storage is so much easier tha…

Haven't even heard of DataPacket, thanks for the link!

And yeah I agree about the "some services are super low cost so you get hooked" thing. Always been my impression of Amazon: they look for what they can apply scale savings on (usually object storage, it seems) and make it cheap and then over-charge for almost everything else.

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#404

Post by pdimitar »

300bps wrote: post #401
pdimitar wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried to scan through the linked article (and OP) but couldn't quite figure out Troy's storage requirements. Are they really massive? The sum of the GB figured shown in the OP doesn't even amount to 200GB AFAICT. But even if it's something like 10TB that's still not super expensive on many hosting providers.

The math says it was 25 TB per day for a month. ($350 per day at .014 per GB)

Ah, you mean bandwidth. I meant how much actual storage at rest (HDD size).

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#405

Post by dylan604 »

b112 wrote: post #347
windexh8er wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The simple answer here is that Troy was using Cloudflare to offset costs he knew he would incur with Azure. He states verbatim: "Firstly, I always knew bandwidth on Azure was expensive and I should have been monitoring it better, particularly on the storage account serving the most data." ...and he didn't have simple monitors in place to alert him of uncommon billing spikes. I get your point, if he's not OK with usin…

There are no savings with cloud, weaving or not. You want to waste money? Hire a car, with a driver, when you need it. Want to save money. Learn to drive. You always pay more for outsourcing stuff, a lot more, than doing it yourself. You can buy 1000x the processing power, by buying baremetal. You can get 100,000x more bandwith for cost, when not using the cloud. People think baremetal is hard. It isn't. It does take…

>You want to waste money? Hire a car, with a driver, when you need it.

> Want to save money. Learn to drive.

Oh please. As if learning to drive is the end of expenses. If you finance a car, you have monthly payments. If you don't, then you have periodic recurring maintenance bills. You always have fuel charges. You always have insurance charges. You periodically have parking charges.

I know how to drive, but do not own a car. From time to time, I hire a car, but it no where gets close to costing me the amount of owning a car would.

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#406

Post by abakker »

usrbinbash wrote: post #394
b112 wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are no savings with cloud, weaving or not. You want to waste money? Hire a car, with a driver, when you need it. Want to save money. Learn to drive. You always pay more for outsourcing stuff, a lot more, than doing it yourself. You can buy 1000x the processing power, by buying baremetal. You can get 100,000x more bandwith for cost, when not using the cloud. People think baremetal is hard. It isn't. It does take…

> People think baremetal is hard. It isn't. It does take knowledge. This. I always wonder how much of the "clouds" success (economic, that is) would have materialized, if the marketing term never got traction, and everyone just called it what it really is: "renting someone elses hardware without physical access, and less, if any, control over how the stack works from the metal up". In the good 'ol days, when people w…

No, no. The costs cloud saves are in staffing and opportunity costs. Everyone knows that it is more expensive than a comparable server, but...it is easy, standard, and available. If you want to a) not have real estate capex, b) not worry about the core ops part of your applications, and c) used to outsource infrastructure to a managed service provider anyway, then Cloud is a viable value prop. Plus, the more of the services you use, the more you app stack becomes "standard" parts with glue code. This is maybe an improvement at the large enterprise scale where home-built apps don't have a reputation for being future proof.

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#407

Post by marcosdumay »

jasode wrote: post #274
lpcvoid wrote: post #56

Can somebody explain to me why I wouldn't just rent a 40 EUR dedicated server from Hetzner with unlimited traffic and gigabit uplink? His 600GB/day is way less than what you get over a gigabit link within a day. Sure, sudden bursts would perhaps "throttle" at a gigabit, but according to his article that was only the cloudflare proxy anyhow, so no pain in having that take a few seconds longer. As far as I am concerned…

>Can somebody explain to me why I wouldn't just rent a 40 EUR dedicated server from Hetzner [...] , I just don't understand why people use cloud services. This recurring question of "why AWS/Azure instead of Hetzner/OVH ?" keeps happening because people are incorrectly comparing higher-level PaaS to lower-level IaaS without realizing it. PaaS != IaaS are not equivalent. IaaS is not a direct drop-in replacement for Pa…

> people are incorrectly comparing higher-level PaaS to lower-level IaaS without realizing it.

Hum, no. People are asking what kind of value that platform adds that can justify all that risk.

And nobody is giving any clear answer, so I'll stand with my previous answer of "none".

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#408

Post by dylan604 »

usrbinbash wrote: post #394
b112 wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are no savings with cloud, weaving or not. You want to waste money? Hire a car, with a driver, when you need it. Want to save money. Learn to drive. You always pay more for outsourcing stuff, a lot more, than doing it yourself. You can buy 1000x the processing power, by buying baremetal. You can get 100,000x more bandwith for cost, when not using the cloud. People think baremetal is hard. It isn't. It does take…

> People think baremetal is hard. It isn't. It does take knowledge. This. I always wonder how much of the "clouds" success (economic, that is) would have materialized, if the marketing term never got traction, and everyone just called it what it really is: "renting someone elses hardware without physical access, and less, if any, control over how the stack works from the metal up". In the good 'ol days, when people w…

Except in what minute of my day am I supposed to take off the hat I'm currently wearing to put on my IT Server Room hat? I don't have time to wrangle this stuff any more. I have multiple clients, I have side hustles, I have what's left of a social life after pandemic, I have family obligations. There are only so many hours in a day. If my time become more effecient by throwing a bit of money at the problem, then it is worth it to pay "experts" at something to relieve me of the burden.

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#409

Post by danparsonson »

dx034 wrote: post #127
alfiedotwtf wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only thing that would really help were a hard spending limit that stops all services except storage. Sadly, I haven't found a way to do that with AWS

It's funny that even Hetzner can do that and AWS can't. Shows that there's no interest from AWS to prevent these things from happening.

*won't

Re: I got pwned by my cloud costs

#410

Post by nunez »

dachryn wrote: post #147
fs111 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like a pretty expensive privilege. How is using cloudflare okay in this then? Cloudflare is also not Azure

Azure is integrated with Cloudflare, if you chose to do so. They also offer Azure CDN, as a competing product. But I don't know if anybody takes it serious or not

Azure CDN is fronted by Akamai; lots of retailers use it, but it's not as big as cloudfront afaik
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