OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October • Hacker News Board

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#401

Post by jhgb » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:29 PM UTC

zdragnar wrote: post #382

tmp_anon_22 wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, the payment processors will bark at the porn site. Move to a more expensive processor for that site only, pay 5%, 10% fee, it doesn't really matter, it's free money. If PH is having trouble processing any form of credit card, a smaller company will have no chance at all. We're seeing a sterilization of legitimate porn on the internet, done by legitimate tax paying western companies. It'll be left to whoever ca…

Free speech, separation of church and state has nothing to do with it. Not wanting to be associated with rape, child and revenge porn (variations on non-consent) is all it is. User submitted content is so much harder to verify facts about (consent in particular) and as long as the user submitted content is sexual in nature, it is legal plutonium.

> User submitted content is so much harder to verify facts about

That doesn't seem to be stopping e-Bay and such. I don't believe that payment processors have any idea what are people buying and selling.

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#402

Post by cody8295 » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:29 PM UTC

zz865 wrote: post #385

rejectedandsad wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that OF is not all in on crypto payments is a massive indictment of crypto as a payment mechanism.

It also highlights the lack of anonymity with crypto - everyone gets to see what you spend money on.

With most crypto, yeah. Monero happens to be private and anonymous.

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#403

Post by devrand » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:30 PM UTC

tmp_anon_22 wrote: post #330

yholio wrote: post #279

I can understand the business reasons for cleaning up the OnlyFans brand. But I can't, for the life of me, understand why they are killing a cash cow instead of spining it off into a side business. Clone the full experience on a dedicated site, OnlyFantasy.com, duplicate the whole userbase, and give a simple warning that I can find my favorite stars on another site. In time, the user bases will diverge naturally depe…

> Yes, the payment processors will bark at the porn site. Move to a more expensive processor for that site only, pay 5%, 10% fee, it doesn't really matter, it's free money. If PH is having trouble processing any form of credit card, a smaller company will have no chance at all. We're seeing a sterilization of legitimate porn on the internet, done by legitimate tax paying western companies. It'll be left to whoever ca…

My understanding is that this industry has way higher than average chargeback/fraud rates, which is really what discourages payment processors/banks from wanting to support them.

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#404

Post by FabHK » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:30 PM UTC

admn2 wrote: post #305

gumby wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had a friend who ran a “sexually explicit” site you’ve heard of. He was paying north of 25% to payment processors (compare to less than .2% restaurants pay…though his margins were much bigger). The payment processors take this attitude because that way they can tell congress they are “doing something about vice”, and in exchange not be subject to undesired regulations. I suspect this kind of soft pressure is being…

Seems like a business opportunity for someone to build a Stripe for vice businesses. Question I know nothing about is besides being stigmatized, do these industries have higher fraud rates? Pretty sure credit card companies won't let you "chargeback" stripe clubs as fraud even if it wasn't you.

> Seems like a business opportunity for someone to build a Stripe for vice businesses.

It seems that was a big part of WireCard's business. Didn't turn out that well. (Though their vice business might've been one of the few parts that actually made some money...)

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#405

Post by handmodel » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:30 PM UTC

throwaway5752 wrote: post #328

taylodl wrote: post #257

Sadly I know girls who are using OnlyFans to keep a roof over their heads and stay out of abusive relationships. Whether we like what they're doing to make money OnlyFans was providing them a much-needed revenue stream. Now that's being taken away from them by the morality police who won't be affected by the consequences of their own decisions.

With all due respect, the fact that anyone is forced into porn to get housing be safe from abusive partners is the indictment of a society. I get that it's a de facto situation for some, but let's not drop the onus on "morality police", payment processors, and OnlyFans for a massive societal failure to help vulnerable people. You could take that argument as far as you want (prostitution, drug sales, etc). There is so…

I do not consume OF but tbh if I was an attractive girl I would probably choose making 80k a year on OF over 30k a year as a hostess or factory worker or whatever. I don't think it is exploitative or has less dignity than these.

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#406

Post by _rpd » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:30 PM UTC

grishka wrote: post #361

dhosek wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some years ago I interviewed with a company that served as a payment risk processor for high-risk businesses (in short, porn). The chargeback rate on online porn is huge . As a result, where a traditional payment processor may be 1.3–3.5% depending on the business and the assessed risk, for a high-risk business, the rate can be much much higher. While Onlyfans keeps 20%, I'm guessing that they'd be badly hurt if they…

Another thing that feels uniquely-US to me is chargebacks. I don't even know what's the process for initiating one in Russia. I once wanted to do that (forgot to disable auto-payment for internet in the apartment I rented and since moved from), called my bank, they told me that there's nothing they could do and I have to talk to the merchant to get a refund. But many comments here imply that chargeback is almost as e…

It makes it easy to comply with the Fair Credit Billing Act:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_Credit_Billing_Act

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#407

Post by throwaway0a5e » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:30 PM UTC

throwaway5752 wrote: post #328

taylodl wrote: post #257

Sadly I know girls who are using OnlyFans to keep a roof over their heads and stay out of abusive relationships. Whether we like what they're doing to make money OnlyFans was providing them a much-needed revenue stream. Now that's being taken away from them by the morality police who won't be affected by the consequences of their own decisions.

With all due respect, the fact that anyone is forced into porn to get housing be safe from abusive partners is the indictment of a society. I get that it's a de facto situation for some, but let's not drop the onus on "morality police", payment processors, and OnlyFans for a massive societal failure to help vulnerable people. You could take that argument as far as you want (prostitution, drug sales, etc). There is so…

They're not forced into it the same way nobody is forced to be an under the table construction laborer. They just consider it to be a better all things considered way to make a living than getting a fast food job or whatever.

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#408

Post by adamc » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:31 PM UTC

bcheung wrote: post #245

_jal wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember this next time people start pushing going cashless. Doing so means that a third party is involved in every transaction you make, and that someone else will always have veto power over your commercial transactions.

Crypto will eventually democratize business transactions but it will take some time and it will not be without increased fraud.

You're assuming the government won't just ban it entirely.

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#409

Post by klodolph » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:31 PM UTC

grishka wrote: post #361

dhosek wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some years ago I interviewed with a company that served as a payment risk processor for high-risk businesses (in short, porn). The chargeback rate on online porn is huge . As a result, where a traditional payment processor may be 1.3–3.5% depending on the business and the assessed risk, for a high-risk business, the rate can be much much higher. While Onlyfans keeps 20%, I'm guessing that they'd be badly hurt if they…

Another thing that feels uniquely-US to me is chargebacks. I don't even know what's the process for initiating one in Russia. I once wanted to do that (forgot to disable auto-payment for internet in the apartment I rented and since moved from), called my bank, they told me that there's nothing they could do and I have to talk to the merchant to get a refund. But many comments here imply that chargeback is almost as e…

In the US, you can't click a button to make a chargeback happen. People are eliding some of the steps or being a bit sloppy with the terminology. A chargeback is something that the bank (or rather, the credit card issuer) does to merchants.

You can log in to your credit card account, click on a transaction, and open a dispute. You have to choose a reason for the dispute. The reason has to be something like, "I was charged for a product, but never received the product."

This just starts the process. The end result may be a chargeback to the merchant.

Re: OnlyFans to block sexually explicit videos starting in October

#410

Post by NikolaNovak » Thu, Aug 19, 2021, 8:32 PM UTC

grishka wrote: post #361

dhosek wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some years ago I interviewed with a company that served as a payment risk processor for high-risk businesses (in short, porn). The chargeback rate on online porn is huge . As a result, where a traditional payment processor may be 1.3–3.5% depending on the business and the assessed risk, for a high-risk business, the rate can be much much higher. While Onlyfans keeps 20%, I'm guessing that they'd be badly hurt if they…

Another thing that feels uniquely-US to me is chargebacks. I don't even know what's the process for initiating one in Russia. I once wanted to do that (forgot to disable auto-payment for internet in the apartment I rented and since moved from), called my bank, they told me that there's nothing they could do and I have to talk to the merchant to get a refund. But many comments here imply that chargeback is almost as e…

The overall theme here is difference between bank, and visa/Mastercard.

If I have a legitimate charge on my debit/chequing account, I too don't know how to reverse it directly through bank.

But if I pay with visa or Mastercard (actual credit cards), I call the toll free number or go to website and start process and go through it.

Partially it's that highbibterest rates pay for policies and systems and options and insurance. Partially that credit card fraud is common so systems must be easy for consumer. E.g. I had my credit card used by somebody else probably 5 to 6 times over 15 years. They'd call me when they detect fraud,we'd go through list of transactions, and based on quick word over phone they'd cancel all transactions that weren't mine. It's a very different process than banking.