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YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

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Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#401

Post by cmonfeat »

laurent92 wrote: post #126
PeterStuer wrote: post #64

Regardless of what you believe to be 'The Truth', has suppression or censorship ever worked to quench dissonance or convince skeptical people, again, whether right or wrong, that there really is 'nothing to see here'.

Censorship has always worked quite well, unfortunately. I grew up believing certain things until, around 30, I went to look up the figures and noticed clichés and prejudices were more correct than teachers and journalists. What a world we live in. Not a situation I’d desire! To start with, it seems Galileo didn’t say « Pero se mueve ». If you pull the string from there, he can’t possibly have been incarcerated for sa…

While censorship is certainly a real thing that happens, many of your examples seem to fall on the side of "History is written by the winners." Selective omission and censorship are not exactly the same thing (although the result can certainly be the same).

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#402

Post by dalbasal »

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #386

Unpopular opinion: it is much better to have a leader hated by the media and who's every move is scrutinized by the press than to have a leader cowtowed by the press and given a free pass on anything. How do I know? I'm from Russia. Authoritatism begins with tight control of news sources.

I think this comment is underrated. Even using the term "censorship" is somewhat dubious when/if the "censor" is acting against the interests/wishes of government.

That said, I think google are making a bad mistake here. They've crossed a line that they've been toeing.

Social media isn't just a mass media. Media is always edited. Editing isn't censorship. But social media is also a communication channel. Haphazard interference in a communication channel sits wrong. We have no frame of reference for it.

Meanwhile, there are credible claims that social media fallacies have caused horrible things (including possibly genocide in Myanmar) in other countries/languages. FB (in that case) has no knowledge of the language or interest in getting involved in that. How can you justify one without the other?

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#403

Post by singlow »

Nacdor wrote: post #396
singlow wrote: post #330

If there is to be toleration in the world, one of the things taught in schools must be the habit of weighing evidence, and the practice of not giving full assent to propositions which there is no reason to believe true. For example, the art of reading the newspapers should be taught. The schoolmaster should select some incident which happened a good many years ago, and roused political passions in its day. He should…

It's depressing to read this quote and then realize it was delivered in 1922, meaning our media has been suffering from this problem of extreme political bias for likely more than a century now. A lot of my friends spend all day "Liking" Facebook posts that mocking Trump supporters as ignorant simpletons, then they repeat blatant falsehoods like "Trump told people to drink bleach" or "Trump called Nazis 'very fine pe…

It's been a lot longer than a century. This is the natural order of things. Bertrand was not criticizing the media as much as he was pointing out its natural tendencies, which originate in the natural tendencies of humans. His solution was not to fix the media, it is to learn how to interpret it.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#404

Post by ramblerman »

enumjorge wrote: post #259
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #110

We are very fortunate to have the algorithms, employees & management of Youtube/Google watching out for us. We're not intelligent enough to view a video and decide for ourselves what is fact v. propaganda v. entertainment. Hopefully some day we will have the same protections the CCP gives its people with even more content moderation. Thank you Google - you're the nanny the American people and the world always hoped f…

Once again a thread about censorship invites comments that ignore the nuance of the situation. Having companies dictate what information is widely accessible is dangerous for democracy. Having the sitting president make completely baseless claims in an effort to delegitimize the results of an election because it didn’t go his way is also dangerous for democracy. That’s what we call a tricky situation. We don’t have a…

> We don’t have an easy solution.

Which is why you keep it simple by allowing all speech. Once you start down the road of a little bit of this, not much of that, and who gets to decide what the complexity only goes up.

Not to mention the honest concern of where that censorship power is held.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#405

Post by hnracer »

nacho2sweet wrote: post #241
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #110

We are very fortunate to have the algorithms, employees & management of Youtube/Google watching out for us. We're not intelligent enough to view a video and decide for ourselves what is fact v. propaganda v. entertainment. Hopefully some day we will have the same protections the CCP gives its people with even more content moderation. Thank you Google - you're the nanny the American people and the world always hoped f…

Why should their algorithm amplify every message? You can go roll your own hosting and host your own video and send the link to whoever you want.

You can't though. Bitchute was banned on Twitter for a long time. The barriers to entry for a new competitor, including network effects in addition to hostility from other platforms, is incredible. YT have a monopoly in their domain.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#406

Post by CamperBob2 »

GordonS wrote: post #400

I don't like what YouTube is doing. But... What is going on in the US just now is unprecedented in modern Western democracies - we've reached "peak fake news" in the USA. Mainstream news networks like Fox have talking heads spouting venomous lies that are demonstrably and trivially proven as such. The POTUS is lying on an hourly basis (many of those lies just brazenly , ridiculously false), and has millions of people…

The POTUS is lying on an hourly basis (many of those lies just brazenly, ridiculously false), and has millions of people believing his every word - he's personally profiting hugely, while brainwashing them and whipping them up into frenzy. Also, I believe his forces should have all the best guns.

Is that a reasonable rephrasing of your point?

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#407

Post by warlord1 »

macspoofing wrote: post #4

For God's sakes ... What underpins this need for social media companies to virtue signal about protecting 'election integrity' is the false notion that 2016 was stolen from Hillary by the Russians - a claim that had no evidential support (and no, that some trolls bought a minuscule amount of Facebook ads does not raise this claim to that level) but the entire Democratic party, with media allies, promulgated for the l…

I'm with you bro. We are numbered 100-to-1 in forums like this where it's very kitschy to unknowingly assent to facist censorship.

I love that you mention Joe Rogan. He's one of the leading Progressives that is bringing up how hypocrticial censorship has in Big Tech.

Everybody knows how absurd censorship has gotten in the last decade –– most noticably since Trump was elected.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#408

Post by tmpz22 »

GordonS wrote: post #400

I don't like what YouTube is doing. But... What is going on in the US just now is unprecedented in modern Western democracies - we've reached "peak fake news" in the USA. Mainstream news networks like Fox have talking heads spouting venomous lies that are demonstrably and trivially proven as such. The POTUS is lying on an hourly basis (many of those lies just brazenly , ridiculously false), and has millions of people…

The GOP has raised over $200m since the election, with very little of it earmarked (I can only see this behavior being completely normalized due to its effectiveness. Short of massive bipartisan regulation limiting election fundraising this is the future of America.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#409

Post by condomhacker »

enumjorge wrote: post #259
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #110

We are very fortunate to have the algorithms, employees & management of Youtube/Google watching out for us. We're not intelligent enough to view a video and decide for ourselves what is fact v. propaganda v. entertainment. Hopefully some day we will have the same protections the CCP gives its people with even more content moderation. Thank you Google - you're the nanny the American people and the world always hoped f…

Once again a thread about censorship invites comments that ignore the nuance of the situation. Having companies dictate what information is widely accessible is dangerous for democracy. Having the sitting president make completely baseless claims in an effort to delegitimize the results of an election because it didn’t go his way is also dangerous for democracy. That’s what we call a tricky situation. We don’t have a…

And that’s why he’s going to the courts instead of using all the other means and powers at his disposal. To ensure that the Democratic process is followed.

Re: YouTube to remove content that alleges widespread election fraud

#410

Post by ksk »

enumjorge wrote: post #259
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #110

We are very fortunate to have the algorithms, employees & management of Youtube/Google watching out for us. We're not intelligent enough to view a video and decide for ourselves what is fact v. propaganda v. entertainment. Hopefully some day we will have the same protections the CCP gives its people with even more content moderation. Thank you Google - you're the nanny the American people and the world always hoped f…

Once again a thread about censorship invites comments that ignore the nuance of the situation. Having companies dictate what information is widely accessible is dangerous for democracy. Having the sitting president make completely baseless claims in an effort to delegitimize the results of an election because it didn’t go his way is also dangerous for democracy. That’s what we call a tricky situation. We don’t have a…

Well, we teach kids how to use knives safely, we don't ban them.
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