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Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

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Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#401

Post by mtrower »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #246
triceratops wrote: post #50

> Drinks for instance cost us more than at the grocery store — but we can’t exactly go get 20 cases of pop per day, so we don’t have much choice. I didn't understand this. It may not be feasible to buy 100 cases of pop at a regular grocery store, but isn't Costco/Sam's Club set up for that? I do think it comes down ultimately to real estate prices. Major metros in North America have gradually become unaffordable for…

That part seemed strange to me. According to people I know that have worked in food/beverage industry, the most expensive part of a cup of Coke at a movie theater or fast food restaurant is the actual cup itself. The liquid inside the cup costs pennies.

Syrup is cheap, water is cheap, C02 is cheap... for a fountain drink, you are indeed correct. The margins here are crazy.

I assumed this vendor was selling bottled or canned soft drinks. Why that is, I couldn't say (just as I couldn't say why they're renting a dishwasher, why they're paying a linen cleaning service rather than purchasing a washing machine, etc...).

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#402

Post by mdtusz »

JackFr wrote: post #176
mark-r wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My favorite is the landlords that refuse to lower their rents to attract tenants. They got a loan to buy the property, and the loan is backed by the revenue potential of the property. If rents decrease, the revenue potential also decreases and the lenders require the property owners to make up the difference. It produces a huge incentive for a property to go unrented at a high price rather than rented at a low price.

I’m familiar with the argument but I think people overstate the importance of unrented high price to refinancing. Banks (and CMBS investors) don’t simply look at market rent levels in isolation. They also look at percent vacant and length of tenancy. Except over the very short term, no one is being deceived.

I can't say that it's specifically the case, but in Montreal, there's been an ever increasing number of vacant commercial spaces - seemingly because they know that "eventually" some BigCo will come along and be willing to pay the extremely high rent. As anecdata, there's a corner space on the ground floor of Duluth and St. Laurent that's been vacant for well over a year - maybe even two. It's pricing out smaller businesses, and even though the space is available and empty, it's just unaffordable and priced far above the true market value.

We don't want more A&W's and Starbucks, but that's what eventually happens here. The only places that survive are bars.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#403

Post by rv-de »

keiferski wrote: post #395
rv-de wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

so, why do you sit then at desk in a generic office? of course working with human beings is more interesting and refreshing than programming bullshit services on a bullshit schedule. no doubts about that. oh wait - you're a philosopher and entrepreneur travelling the world (4hww and drop shipping ?) - judging from that self-description you are part of that scene where everybody needs to be passionate and craving for…

This comment is uncalled for and doesn’t belong on HN. I have nothing to do with drop shipping, 4HWW, or whatever imaginary identity you’ve given to me. I have a degree in analytical philosophy and I live abroad. Pretty straightforward.

> or whatever imaginary identity you’ve given to me

exactly, don't take it personal. I don't know you. my reply rather speaks to a stereotype. but some aspects about the article, its language and some of the replies rubs me the wrong way. in that sense, sorry, for any disturbances.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#404

Post by distances »

ido wrote: post #399
distances wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And for $15 in Berlin you would expect a main course, glass of wine, and espresso in a decent sit-down place, tips included.

$15 CA is €9.50...The meal you describe would still cost more than that, maybe $20 CA & that would be the cheaper end of the spectrum (€7 Mittagsmenü, €3 wine, €1.5 espresso + 10% tip, then convert € to $CA). If you're in central business locations in Mitte or Charlottenburg it would be more than that. That said you have very cheap options for Turkish, Arab or Vietnamese food in other districts like Neukölln. One of…

Right, I was thinking USD so ~13€. For that you have a nice main, wine, and coffee in half the ethnic places of Berlin. Not in Mitte as you said though.

As a side note, I don't know anyone actually tipping 10%. At this price range usually it's rounded to next full euro.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#405

Post by veggieburglar »

zhoujianfu wrote: post #224
kinkrtyavimoodh wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the passion argument is that valuable. For a LOT of people programming is their passion. Yet they command some of the highest salaries. The labor market doesn't care about passion. It will settle where it needs to based on demand and supply.

I think he's saying the passion factor will increase the supply. I think the same thing happens some with programming, it's just a lot fewer people have the passion (and ability?) than for cooking food. The same thing happens with teachers, nurses, firemen, police... I think the reason they generally don't make more money is many people have a passion for doing those jobs (ask ten kids what they want to be when they…

They aren’t super difficult?

Teachers, nurses, firemen, and police officers would like to have a word with you.

Programming may be mathematically complex and difficult to learn, but it does not corner the market on difficulty.

Try adapting a teaching curriculum for online learning for fourth graders, working 16 shifts in an ICU during a pandemic while trying to keep people safe, planning and organizing a response to statewide wildfires, or de-escalating complex interpersonal issues dealing with crime, safety, and mental illness on the daily.

Do any of those sound easy to you?

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#406

Post by biddlesby »

kenneth wrote: post #332
simonebrunozzi wrote: post #215

I really dislike the way in which this article has been written - it reads as the typical piece from the "bro culture" that massively ignores the rest of the world. Besides this, which is not the point... 1) most restaurants in US and high-end Europe that survive and thrive do so by having big margins on alcohol. Their margins are not single-digits. (edit: just saw other comments mentioning this). 2) Many restaurateu…

A "bro culture" article written by a female entrepreneur who isn't from Silicon Valley… right. I think you need to check your prejudices. 1) plenty of restaurants don't sell alcohol, including it seems this one. she also had a point about how drinks aren't a great revenue generator given the price you can expect to charge in a fast-casual setting vs. the costs (higher than grocery stores) 2) how is the restauranteur'…

A woman can just as easily write a bro-culture article as a man, and you don't have to have worked in Silicon Valley to pick up on the culture. It's splashed all over the internet.

If the article reads like bro culture, that's a valid observation, irrespective of the gender or background of the author.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#407

Post by ryukafalz »

trophycase wrote: post #192
alexashka wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want small restaurants as much as I want shoe makers instead of automated Nike factories. The way forward is not by enabling people who can serve 500 people/day to exist when we can have a robot serving 5,000. We want automation, we want people doing what they choose to do because we've automated away things they had to do, such as work for a living. The way to get there is more automation. Restaurant cooks/servers…

Work is what gives life meaning for many people. You can't just say we'll automate most productive tasks then expect everyone to be mozart or do yoga all day or something. That's not a future I want.

There’s plenty to do even if you’re not a talented musician: volunteering for a good cause, inventing, crafting...

I strongly suspect that if the most tedious jobs were automated away, so long as people had their needs met, they’d find something much more meaningful than the work they were doing before. I know I sure would!

“So long as they have their needs met” is a big assumption, though, and one that wouldn’t hold up in our current society.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#408

Post by veggieburglar »

simonw wrote: post #276
winter_blue wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, a döner can be made for far less money . They're using over-the-top expensive premium ingredients, but if you just use regular supermarket ingredients, you could make a döner for far far less . Let me attempt a prices breakdown: I'm in the U.S., and the nearby Aldi sells boneless, skinless chicken breasts for $2.49 per pound (a restaurant could probably order in bulk, and get that an even lower price). A pound i…

That's because Tara Inn is a bar. They likely lose money on the cheap food and make it up on drinks.

At least in California, restaurant and bar licenses are separate. Restaurants have to prove that a certain percentage of their sales are food related; otherwise you can’t allow anyone under 21 into the establishment.

Re: Why Restaurants Are So Fucked

#409

Post by aoeu12332 »

simonebrunozzi wrote: post #215

I really dislike the way in which this article has been written - it reads as the typical piece from the "bro culture" that massively ignores the rest of the world. Besides this, which is not the point... 1) most restaurants in US and high-end Europe that survive and thrive do so by having big margins on alcohol. Their margins are not single-digits. (edit: just saw other comments mentioning this). 2) Many restaurateu…

0) I kind of wonder how anything that reads as a typical piece from a certain culture could not be criticized for massively ignoring the rest of the world.

1) In France most restaurants sell the same desserts that they buy from the same wholesale Metro that's open only to food professionals. They buy it less than a euro and sell it more than five, with a bit of an english cream they buy by liters.

2) Not sure what's your source, but I suppose running a tobacco shop would be far easier. I have yet to know one restaurant owner who has 0 experience as either a waiter or a cook.

3) Basically you're saying that doing 0 business activity is "not too bad", when you still have to pay the rent. Just because you've spoke with a couple of owners in Italy and Japan.

4) You can be good, but paying for a 10k/month rent + furlough and making absolutely 0 business activity after throwing away your stocks can kill your business even if you're a "good restaurateur".

But maybe Simone is right: if COVID killed your business then it's because you're not "good enough".

I've yet to read such a both senseless and self sufficient comment on hn.

Nice culture, nice inclusiveness, maybe one day you grow a heart.

Somebody had to say this.

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