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The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

paulgraham.com

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Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#401
post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What separates piano and OS hscking from making dinner, for you? What is mundane versus interesting? It seems to reduce the problem back to what might lead to a useful discovery versus what won't. But piano is likely in the latter category, given that its obsessed about so often over centuries. Maybe the time for OS hacking to lead to discoveries is on its way out, as well. Obsessive cooking might be more likely to b…

I think that's the whole point. It's not about what is interesting and what not, but what truly obsesses you . What OP means is that cooking is not something he feels obsessed about. It's great if you are obsessed about cooking and have 10 hours a day to practice your cooking. But most of us, wish we had more time to explore the topics we are deeply attracted to. If they make a difference, all the better.

That said many topics are deeply fascinating in their own ways, and we just haven't stopped & looked close enough to discover it.

Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#402
post #393

Two reactions to this. I almost believe these: 1. The difference between collecting bus tickets, working on mathematics, and figuring the crystallization patterns of snowflakes is virtually nothing. To the people obsessed with it, it is all-important; to outsiders, all three look indistinguishably pointless. Only in retrospect can anyone say whether the activity led to something society considers important. The truly…

> 2. Genius is overrated. What? > But for nearly every invention and idea, history shows that multiple people were working on it at the same time. Not just "people" - "geniuses". History shows multiple geniuses were working on it at the same time. I do agree that we give too much credit to a single genius. Had Isaac Newton not lived, we'd still have calculus, physics, etc in some form or another. The same thing with…

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Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#403
post #72

Competitive gaming is a particularly good example of this. I followed most of the rise of Dota from trashy Warcraft 3 mod to Valve's multi-million-dollar-prize-pool juggernaut. The first few crops of Dota millionaires all had the same backstory: "I played this game 14 hours a day. If there were tournaments at all they didn't really pay anything. My parents said I was wasting my life. I never had a girlfriend. Everyon…

> Competitive gaming is a particularly good example of this

>> it's more promising if you're creating something, rather than just consuming something someone else creates

Gaming consumes the creative efforts of others. It's fun, invigorating and a healthy pass-time. But it's not good ground for growing genius.

Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#404
What I find interesting is these two contrasting undertones:

1) Geniuses who are obsessed with their own interests, not the outcome of pursuing their interest

2) PG obsessed with outcome (great work, being famous, leaving your mark on important topics, etc) and trying to control what you're interested in to affect the outcome.

The recipe for genius work is to be crazy obsessed. But according to the article, to be crazy obsessed with something is not something that you can necessarily control:

> Darwin couldn't turn it off. Neither could Ramanujan. They didn't discover the hidden paths that they did because they seemed promising, but because they couldn't help it.

> But it may be that much of the skew has a simpler explanation: different people are interested in different things.

Yet there's also attempts to reason about how to control your own interests towards meaningful impact within the recognized limitations (that talent and interest both matter, and the implication is that some people just may not be born with talent or interest).

It reads like classical Greek Mythology - trying to fight against fate with the sheer force of will in the struggle to control how one leaves their mark on history.

Real geniuses ironically probably don't care about how to leave their mark on history. But on the other hand, being obsessed with leaving a mark on history may be a certain kind of genius as well.

I think the article could be improved by spending more time doing systems thinking rather than self optimization for the conclusion.

I think the self optimization part of the article (how to maximize your impact on history) does not yield much insight or conversation and hence reads poorly.

However, how to build systems (like educational systems) that increase the output of genius work seems much more promising direction for actionable insights but it is taken very lightly.

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Just because I have the thought.

The cognitive functions side of MBTI blends very well into an article like this. Cognitive functions states that there are things that we are more "innately interested in" than others, but instead of discrete topics, these are more like input senses.

Consider your 5 physical senses as inputs into your brain. Your brain usually notices or cares about some of them much more than others (Tone deaf vs perfect pitch). Some people "care" so much that every time a sense is violated, they will definitely let you know (what's that smell???).

Similarly, cognition can be viewed as inputs into your brain, and cognitive functions are the different senses into your brain. I'll list out a few:

Ti (introverted thinking) - the sense of whether something is factually right

Te (extroverted thinking) - the sense of whether something is systematically consistent

Fi (introverted feeling) - the sense of whether something induces harmony

Fe (extroverted feeling) - the sense of whether something creates harmonious society

etc.

Cognitive functions are split between what you take in as information and how you evaluate the information. The above is how you evaluate information. The following is how you take it in:

Ni (introverted intuition) - you notice ideas as complete building blocks within themselves

Ne (extroverted intuition) - you notice ideas as interconnecting with other ideas

Si (introverted sensing) - you notice the concrete world as complete experiences within themselves

Se (extroverted sensing) - you notice the concrete world as interconnecting with other experiences

Cognitive functions states that you have primary functions that you use to perceive the world, just like someone may notice sounds much more than touch or smell.

It suggests a vocabulary for talking about interest and obsession.

Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#405

One associated personality trait I've observed in the obsessive and successful is guilt free myopia . If you either don't notice, or don't care, when people around you are negatively impacted by your obsession you can get so much more done. I must emphasize I don't think there's usually any malice involved, just an ability to forget that not eating dinner with your significant other might make them mad, or that being…

Yeah. When you really realize the price that your children have paid for you being lost in your own world, it's not so guilt free...

Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#406

Two reactions to this. I almost believe these: 1. The difference between collecting bus tickets, working on mathematics, and figuring the crystallization patterns of snowflakes is virtually nothing. To the people obsessed with it, it is all-important; to outsiders, all three look indistinguishably pointless. Only in retrospect can anyone say whether the activity led to something society considers important. The truly…

A fantastic book by Vernon Vinge called “A Deepness in the Sky” toys around with this idea a lot actually. There is a virus that can release neurotoxins and it is flipped in very specific parts of the brain with a MRI-like device. This can elicit a state of “Focus” where the person (victim more like) becomes totally obsessed with a particular idea or subject. They devote all energy towards this subject and can make s…

Thank you so much. I read this book when it came out 20 years ago and have been trying to remember what it was called at odd times, On and Off, for roughly the last decade, specifically because of the plot point of the “Focus” virus.

Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#407

I agree with his theory, but what I find particularly interesting is that I think most people do not have an obsessive interest in anything at all. And as someone who has obsessive interests in a lot of things (some “useful”, some not), that seems really odd to me: how can you just be satisfied to go to work, come home, watch TV, and go to bed each day? (Not saying that’s the wrong way to live, just saying it is surp…

> I agree with his theory, but what I find particularly interesting is that I think most people do not have an obsessive interest in anything at all. I am not convinced that this is true. I think a lot more people are really interested or passionate about something than you may realize, but not all of them talk about those things to everyone. Alternatively, their passion might be what they do for a living. So for ins…

I have a hard time agreeing with this. In my experience people's single most interesting thing to talk about is themselves. Once you notice that, you see it everywhere. It's such a lure, it's almost irresistible. I've made it a habit to ask them a couple of open questions and then just let them have at it. In a few situations folks lost business with me simply because they were too preoccupied with talking about themselves to simply ask "so... how about you? what do you do?"

It follows that whenever someone has an obsession, it comes up naturally while they talk about themselves.

Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#408
post #393

Two reactions to this. I almost believe these: 1. The difference between collecting bus tickets, working on mathematics, and figuring the crystallization patterns of snowflakes is virtually nothing. To the people obsessed with it, it is all-important; to outsiders, all three look indistinguishably pointless. Only in retrospect can anyone say whether the activity led to something society considers important. The truly…

> 2. Genius is overrated. What? > But for nearly every invention and idea, history shows that multiple people were working on it at the same time. Not just "people" - "geniuses". History shows multiple geniuses were working on it at the same time. I do agree that we give too much credit to a single genius. Had Isaac Newton not lived, we'd still have calculus, physics, etc in some form or another. The same thing with…

Were all great discoveries and works made by “geniuses”? Or do we assign them the title in retrospect?

Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#409
There are two other ingredients to genius that are even less often discussed:

1. Opportunity

2. A sense that pursuing opportunities is important

Some never find good opportunities to learn and never improve. Some are surrounded by good opportunities to learn but never recognize them or don't think they're important to pursue. Being in an environment with good opportunities and having the impulse to pursue them has a lot to do with your personal background and upbringing. Surely counterexamples can be found, but I think they're in the minority. Until society comes to terms with this, it will continue to waste most of its intellectual talent.

Re: The Bus Ticket Theory of Genius

#410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 'problem' with modern science is that a large finite amount of stuff has been discovered, and new discoveries are most often built on that stuff. I splash around in the backwaters of machine learning, however I have to pick my targets carefully and maintain a very tight focus - the defined knowledge base has already grown to more than anyone can ingest in detail. Given the amount of knowledge that has to be absor…

The problem with modern science is that there is no room for the unusual. Faraday had no formal training, but his natural intuition, interest, and tenacity made him standout. Newton was a brilliant, paranoid asshole. Instead funding goes to credentialed career scientists whose greatest ability is self-promotion, fund raising, and stringing-along the public. As an example: The next big particle accelerator sucks up bi…

In Newton's day a single person could probably learn all the math and science there was to be learned in the entire world.

Now things are much more specialized and require years of formal study just to get a base level of knowledge in one tiny aspect.

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