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Apple has locked me out of my developer account

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Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#401

Post by bogwog »

saganus wrote: post #276
ouid wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are in complete control of the programs that you can install on your iphone, and take 30% of all transactions that occur through that marketplace. Are you a lawyer for apple?

I think the point is that there are other app stores in other platforms, so monopoly rules don't apply. Their app store is their monopoly, sure, but if you don't want to use Apple products you are not barred from using other cellphones and app stores. This is different than, e.g. saying that there is a monopoly with the electricity provider. If you don't want to use company A for that, you have absolutely no access t…

> as per the current definition, it's not a monopoly.

That's why I said they should be regulated...because they currently aren't. When anti-trust laws were being written, software walled gardens weren't a thing. They should be updated for modern times, since the App Store is basically its own industry. It brings in tens of billions of dollars in revenue every year, which is more than the GDP of some countries.

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#402

Post by bogwog »

supernova87a wrote: post #310
ouid wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are in complete control of the programs that you can install on your iphone, and take 30% of all transactions that occur through that marketplace. Are you a lawyer for apple?

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean that it's illegal or calls for another government regulation. When did being able to access / sell to a private marketplace become an entitlement of public accommodation? If the Supreme Court rules in favor of this then by all means go ahead and assert this. I personally don't believe the iPhone App Store (or any other app store) yet rises to the level of a forum of open pu…

> You are perfectly free to develop apps and sell them elsewhere.

Yeah, you just lose access to a giant chunk of the market and severely limit your growth potential.

The entire industry with its millions of jobs and immeasurable value to society is two stores owned by two companies. That needs to be regulated.

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#403

Post by serf »

FussyZeus wrote: post #120
mortenjorck wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My bigger issue here is the complete lack of transparency or visibility into the process. This is indeed the core of the problem. If Apple provided a clear citation, e.g. “the following protected information was shared under your name at this URL on this date, which violates section xyz of your developer agreement,” it would still be unfortunate, but it would be miles ahead of Apple’s maddening “for more informatio…

This is impossible at scale and a waste of a companies' time. Apple doesn't care if your account is reinstated. Odds are (just like the author here) you know exactly why your account is suspended. If you honestly don't, then you didn't do your due diligence in signing up. And, even if they cited whatever part of whatever agreement, it would just be onto the next excuse. It's a bottomless pit of arguing that solves no…

>Odds are (just like the author here) you know exactly why your account is suspended. If you honestly don't, then you didn't do your due diligence in signing up.

as someone who has been a victim of automated bans and account deactivation multiple times on multiple platforms, I view this statement as factually incorrect.

>Nobody's app idea is so fucking star spangled awesome as to make them above the rules.

Except, historically, any apps made by FAANG.

I'm never in defense of actions where the victim is entirely out of the loop with regards to corrections they could possibly make in order to comply with whatever rules need to be complied with.

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#404

Post by Razengan »

205guy wrote: post #337
rootusrootus wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Goodwill. Just because you're the big gorilla and can act as such with impunity doesn't mean you ought to constantly remind people of that. One developer doesn't matter in the grand scheme, but every time they get to the front page of HN with a story like this it chips away at Apple's (or Google's, or whoever's) reputation. Collectively that does have value.

Actually, every time an app dev gets to the front page with a story like this, one of the top commenters has more info that paints them in a much more negative light. Which is exactly what happened in this case (using dev account to access inside information). It happens so often that I am beginning to trust Apple's judgement and reactions, not developers (fair disclosure: I am not an iOS or Android app dev, the shea…

Also see the Dash debacle:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12680131

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#405

Post by Reelin »

sjwright wrote: post #394
Reelin wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you actually think it's an acceptable state of affairs for a company to be able to unilaterally put a non-competing and unrelated company out of business on a whim? Apple isn't a traditional distribution channel. If FedEx bans me, I can switch to UPS (or USPS, or ...); if Apple bans me, for all practical purposes I can't compete in the mobile space in the US anymore.

Is it a "whim" for Apple to act in accordance with their stated policy?

It might or might not be, but that misses my point.

The issue isn't (necessarily) that Apple banned a particular account for a particular reason. The issue is that Apple (or Google) banning an account could easily render a given company (in an unrelated market segment) non-competitive overnight. That company would effectively have no recourse, and there is no alternative provider for them to switch to. I do not think that's a generally desirable state of affairs.

A reasonable analogy (in the US) would be an ISP banning a particular website. If the ISP were large enough (ex Comcast or Verizon), any web based US business banned in this manner would effectively become non-viable on the spot.

Tech companies should not be allowed to unilaterally control our economy in this manner. (This is all in addition to the existing consumer protection concerns.)

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#406

Post by scarface74 »

bsder wrote: post #391
scarface74 wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So can you give any examples in the US or the EU where such a definition has ever been used? In that case are all of the console makers “monopolies” since they have to approve both digital and physical media distributed on their platform? Does Apple also have a “monopoly” in the smart speaker market since they control what runs on the HomePod even though they are a distance third to Amazon and Google? What about the…

> In that case are all of the console makers “monopolies” since they have to approve both digital and physical media distributed on their platform? Personally, I would say that they are monopolies. And people are starting to think about them that way because so many games now have an "always online" component. The problem is that even if I own a game disk, that game that I paid money for is suddenly worthless when So…

The laws weren't "changed" to make those monopolies. They were monopolies by the original definition of the law.

And whether you "personally" think they are monopolies. They are in no sense of the word "monopolies" by any definition that has been used by the US or EU.

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#407

Post by zepto »

michaelmrose wrote: post #257
cmcd wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, third party app stores are not officially supported and for good reason. I am not sure what the alternative is, create a unmoderated free for all app store? That goes pretty heavily against the Apple ecosystem's philosophy and would make it easy for people to download damaging apps which Apple would then get blamed for because they added an official channel for installing them.

The alternative has been functional for decades. You have a single "store" interface with user configurable channels which users can add at their own risk. If you don't make it trivial for an attacker to induce a user to configure such a channel you avoid most bad outcomes for stupid people. For example you shouldn't be able to click a link and prompt the user as such prompts do not work. Personally I would expect -…

It’s always trivial for an ‘attacker’ to induce a user to configure a bad channel.

Those ‘attackers’ will be the same media outlets who encouraged people to Jailbreak in the early days, or Google and Facebook using their respective monopolies to blanket advertise.

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#408

Post by Aeolun »

sircastor wrote: post #127
rmsaksida wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if that's all true, and even if Apple has good reasons to lock his account, why not just tell him the reason? I don't understand why tech companies have this passive aggressive attitude when users violate their rules of witholding information and giving some vague canned responses when asked about what's going on. Just tell him what happened in detail.

This is probably not the reason, but the first thing that comes to my mind is that providing a reason provides substance and reasoning for a response. The 'why' allows an individual to respond with a '...yes, but' and Apple doesn't want to deal with that.

I guess? But they’re not dealing with it now either, so I’m not sure it would be any different?

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#409

Post by zepto »

akira2501 wrote: post #217
johndubchak wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I strongly support some government action to change the current state of affairs with regards to the App Store being the only way to get apps on iOS A very slippery slope that will not end well for anyone, i.e. Apple, end users, and developers included. This is something I wouldn't advocate for personally and I'm not an Apple fanboi. I don't particularly care for the closed ecosystem but it does create security adv…

> A very slippery slope that will not end well for anyone, An anti-trust case against an established monopoly is a slippery slope? I'm having trouble understanding the fear here. > I don't particularly care for the closed ecosystem but it does create security advantages Anyone can claim "security advantages" from their walled garden, there's nothing particular about their implementation that grants them any additiona…

There is no established monopoly.

Re: Apple has locked me out of my developer account

#410

Post by rodgerd »

ninju wrote: post #351
threeseed wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do we know Apple didn't provide that ? If the author is being disingenuous and misrepresenting why likely was banned then I am sure other facts are being left out as well.

> If the author is being disingenuous and misrepresenting why likely was banned then I am sure other facts are being left out as well. And how do you know the author is being disingenuous ?

He's suggesting that, out of the blue, Apple have suspended his account and he can't imagine any possible reason why.

If he's been reverse engineering and publish the results of developer-only pre-releases in violation of his T&Cs, then he has a pretty good idea why.

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