Broken • Hacker News Board

Re: Broken

#401

Post by m45t3r » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:42 AM UTC

I mean, even the supposed top software product from Apple nowadays, iPadOS, is suffering from annoying bugs.

This will be the third time I have to reboot my iPad 6th gen today, the first two were because the keyboard would randomly close and not come back (if someone has a workaround for this issue, I would be grateful, it is a really annoying bug specially since it happened while I was writing a big text) [1].

Now, the app that I use for Hacker News (Octal) is broken on the dock, so the only way to switch to it is using the Expose-like screen. I already tried to force remove it from dock, however opening it again triggered the same bug. Also, force touching the icon shows a “Share (null)” (probably the cause of the bug).

I know, not a big deal (making the user reboot three times in one day, however, should be a big deal). But this is for their top product for gods sake. I don’t want to even imagine how Catalina is.

[1]: If this was Android I could at least force close the keyboard app. I didn’t find a way to force closing iPadOS keyboard, BTW, I tried to add and remove keyboard languages without success. Also annoying that I had to use another device to search about this issue since, you know, I had no keyboard at all.

Re: Broken

#402

Post by anextio » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:42 AM UTC

dTal wrote: post #370

blunte wrote: post #203

It's all very depressing. Like most of us here, I have become increasingly frustrated with the state of Mac (touch bar, bad keyboards, odd choices that fit neither creators nor developers well, and so on). No point rehashing it all. But where does that leave us? I spent a year on Windows 10 not so long ago, on upper end laptop hardware with HiDPI screen, and it was less fun and more problem prone than macOS - especia…

> Getting and keeping a Linux Desktop in good working order is harder than it should be at this age of Linux. Maybe because all the developers ran away to Macs, instead of sticking around dogfooding and fixing bugs? Free software is a collaborative social enterprise - it's not really anyone's job to make free stuff for you to use. If, as a developer, you've taken the easy path of proprietary software for years, and n…

While I sympathize with your political position on free software, I have come to the unfortunate conclusion that this point of view is idealistic[1] and short sighted.

The vast majority of engineers don’t commit to switching to free software not because not enough hearts and minds have been convinced yet but because the entire economy and the basis of everyone’s material existence depends on a system that is at this moment market-based.

The popularity of proprietary software stacks is ultimately structural, as are the problems and caveats of proprietary software. Engineers are, in the vast majority, dependent on selling their labor to the commercial employment market for their livelihood, in many cases an extreme amount of labor in a highly competitive environment.

It is absolutely great that many engineers dedicate free labor to contributing to free software, and it is completely unreasonable to expect that anything at all could make the vast majority do it. Not an unreasonable expectation of an individual, but of the structure.

[1] in the sense of philosophical idealism vs materialism

Re: Broken

#403

Post by swiley » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:46 AM UTC

gowld wrote: post #253

als0 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While on the subject, on Linux I've also noticed that Xscreensaver (or GNOME screensaver, can't remember which) sometimes goes straight into the desktop after wakeup for a few seconds before the lock screen prompt actually appears. You can even run programs. Really bizarre and feels like this issue has been present for a while now. Has anyone else noticed this or is it just me?

It's REALLY important to distinguish between Xscreensaver and GNOME screensaver. Warning: copy-paste this link, if jwz sees an HN referrer, you won't be happy. www.jwz.org/blog/2015/04/i-told-you-so-again/

I run the real xscreensaver though (I was building it from the source until around this time last year, now I run the one from alpine but I don’t think they’ve done anything weird (I haven’t checked though))

I’m pretty sure I’ve seen what everyone is talking about and it’s bothered me a little too (granted, my machine is configured in such an undiscoverable way that just opening an xterm window is obscure enough to be nearly equivalent to a very short pin, and then you need to know bash. Now that I’m not in college and don’t have anything important that’s probably good enough even without xcreensaver.)

Re: Broken

#404

Post by tylerjwilk00 » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:46 AM UTC

I have been using Linux on my home workstations for over 10 years. I use a MacBook Pro 1 day a week for work for 5 years. I occasionally use a Windows 10 machine if a friend or family member needs help.

Linux desktop is easily my most productive and least worse environment. It's so smooth to develop on. All other OS behave like an annoying authoritarian dictator. And Windows specifically is a kafkaesque dumpster fire of menus and windows all with seemingly different design concepts. MacOS is pretty consistent in design and performance but using the machine it's obvious that developer productivity is not their top goal and you can't develop using a mobile phone as your workhorse so desktops are all we got.

Re: Broken

#405

Post by rjblackman » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:46 AM UTC

renaudg wrote: post #300

snapples wrote: post #131

Things are so broken here at Apple. I joined about 4 years ago. I am awed by the fact that we manage to release any software at all, let alone functional software. The biggest problem is communication. No one fucking communicates. - No communication between orgs. Tons of bureaucratic tape to cut through just to get a hand on someone working on a different product - Barely any communication between teams. Literally ev…

> - So what happens is that you’re working on a product that’s part of another product but you never talked to any other teams or orgs on how to make your product fit in I'm surprised to read this, because I've always thought tight integration and clever synergies between product lines were precisely one of the things Apple excelled at. And I was wondering how exactly they managed to make that happen in such a famous…

the fact that GP is complaining about it may be an indication. by hiring good people who see the structural problems and work around them works. you can brute force work around poor management and a bad structure.

Edit: you can see this explained in one of snapples sibling posts.

Re: Broken

#406

Post by melenaboija » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:47 AM UTC

dTal wrote: post #370

blunte wrote: post #203

It's all very depressing. Like most of us here, I have become increasingly frustrated with the state of Mac (touch bar, bad keyboards, odd choices that fit neither creators nor developers well, and so on). No point rehashing it all. But where does that leave us? I spent a year on Windows 10 not so long ago, on upper end laptop hardware with HiDPI screen, and it was less fun and more problem prone than macOS - especia…

> Getting and keeping a Linux Desktop in good working order is harder than it should be at this age of Linux. Maybe because all the developers ran away to Macs, instead of sticking around dogfooding and fixing bugs? Free software is a collaborative social enterprise - it's not really anyone's job to make free stuff for you to use. If, as a developer, you've taken the easy path of proprietary software for years, and n…

I have been dealing with computers since I started CS in school 18 years ago, and well my preferences have been changing since then.

I used to love playing with computers and being able to try different linux distributions even if I had to spend 5 hours to have a usable external monitor (actually spending that time was one of the best parts) but that changed mostly because of my needs, but also because of my economy.

When I had to start being more productive and I could afford it I bought my first Mac Book, and it lasted ten years! At that point I realized that maybe for me it was worth it spending that money and using that time to configure a keyboard doing something else.

I feel I was the target at that time for Apple with some of their products, maybe now things have changed and I am not anymore.

And I guess yes, marketing is what is driving them, but I think they are abandoning part of what they used to be their target and, hopefully, someone will fill that void with something that makes me as happy as when I bought my first Mac Book.

BTW, now I am using a Pixelbook and a Mac Book for my personal stuff and Windows professionally and although is getting worst and worst I will still keep buying them.

Re: Broken

#407

Post by JabavuAdams » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:49 AM UTC

clopez wrote: post #397

dTal wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Getting and keeping a Linux Desktop in good working order is harder than it should be at this age of Linux. Maybe because all the developers ran away to Macs, instead of sticking around dogfooding and fixing bugs? Free software is a collaborative social enterprise - it's not really anyone's job to make free stuff for you to use. If, as a developer, you've taken the easy path of proprietary software for years, and n…

This!. Love your reply. I'm also tired of developers criticizing Linux desktop for not being friendly enough and running away to propietary systems instead of trying to help to fix what they don't like of Linux Desktop. That's the good thing of open source: don't like it? Then fix it and send me a patch and stop complaining. Its not like propietary systems where you only can complain (you can't fix)

Maybe they want to get stuff done, other than puttering around in the tooling. It's a nice option to have, but would be ruinous to productivity.

Also, design by committee rarely produces good UI. You can patch little UI bugs, but if you really want to holistically improve the UI it's a huge undertaking.

Just because you're developer, doesn't mean you want to hack on every tool you use. Software has gotten way too big for that.

Re: Broken

#408

Post by rodgerd » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:56 AM UTC

zanny wrote: post #215

saagarjha wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue is that culture at Apple is very much not supposed to be this, and this probably isn’t what the C-suite is intending to push. So you’re not really going against them; rather, you’re going with them but against the current status quo.

If upper management wants culture to change they will take the action necessary to change it. The last people to be powerless to inflict change on a corporation are the executives running said business.

You should do some reading about the idea of the "frozen middle", which is pretty much what's being described as the problem. It's as resistant to edicts from the top as ground-up initiatives from the bottom.

Re: Broken

#409

Post by JabavuAdams » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:57 AM UTC

ekianjo wrote: post #311

blunte wrote: post #203

It's all very depressing. Like most of us here, I have become increasingly frustrated with the state of Mac (touch bar, bad keyboards, odd choices that fit neither creators nor developers well, and so on). No point rehashing it all. But where does that leave us? I spent a year on Windows 10 not so long ago, on upper end laptop hardware with HiDPI screen, and it was less fun and more problem prone than macOS - especia…

> to work is a lot of effort, and then mysteriously something will stop working. Oh Please. this lie keeps getting repeated every single time this topic comes up. Meanwhile people who actually use Linux every single day have like zero issues for years to keep things running and working. I have 4 machines using different flavors, getting updates all the time and nothing mysteriously breaking, and this for years. Sure,…

Sample bias? Linux users are people who aren't sufficiently bothered by Linux's flaws or don't encounter any flaws due to their HW / usage patterns. Same as any other OS.

To say the parent poster is lying is a bit much. You have know idea what kind of stuff they're trying to do.

Re: Broken

#410

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 1:57 AM UTC

mherrmann wrote: post #22

Can I just say how happy I am with Xfce. It's a Linux desktop environment that looks like in the early 2000s. It's fast. There are no unnecessary frills. It just gets the job done. Its release cycles are measured in several years, and keep it minimal. I used to be on Windows, then macOS, then Ubuntu and now this. As a developer with soon to be 20 years of experience, it's the best environment I've had.

[deleted]