America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births • Hacker News Board

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#401

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 5:11 PM UTC

eeeeeeeeeeeee wrote: post #320

rootusrootus wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They must be so bored… Your preconceived notions of what suburban living is like are just as inaccurate as the perceptions of city life of the person you responded to.

Then why do people from suburbs flock to the cities for their entertainment? Or build their suburbs right on the edge of cities? Suburbs are boring. I grew up in them and much of my family still lives in them. I understand why people live in them — cost and space for raising kids, but they are definitely boring. And most of the people I know that live in them wouldn’t disagree, it’s a necessity driven by cost.

> Then why do people from suburbs flock to the cities for their entertainment?

In ages past, this had more to do with shopping than entertainment. I suspect that it will become obvious that Amazon has negated this need, partially or wholly. The only they don't sell (mostly) is groceries, which for the large part were and are available locally.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#402

Post by dexen » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 5:14 PM UTC

NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #398

dexen wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Not sure what comes after step 3 The steps 1...3 you described are literally "the demand for housing will gradually fall". What follows is, naturally, gradual lowering of the prices, with subsequent stabilization and rebirth. Curiously enough we observe the same patterns in nature: a species out-grows its prime ecological niche; the population starts falling down (usually without outright crashing), and then stabili…

The cycle doesn't always repeat. The cycle only repeats if fertility rates stay where they always have been... the elk continue to attempt procreation at the rates they always have. Then,once the foraging/pasture regrows, that rate being the same, the elk rebound. Calhoun proved this. The mice would, despite having everything they needed, despite the population crash giving them the space they apparently required, ju…

You described effect observed in population that grew up in, and descended exclusively from generations living in singular over-crowded space with full living necessities supplies.

Humans out in the real world aren't like that. Some live in the crowded city, some live in the open regions. Some hunt for best deals in the mall, others hunt for the game for lunch. There's a constant trickle of cultural & genetic mixing, and there's a lot of small towns etc. that are somewhere in-between on the scale of self-reliance.

If the city populations were to crash, we the humans wouldn't really suffer all that much. Perhaps less new entertainment content would be produced, but the necessities would be taken care of as per the usual, knowledge would be preserved, and communication & trade would go on. In due time, cities would be re-populated.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#403

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 5:17 PM UTC

dpeck wrote: post #88

tathougies wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So my moms parents had three children and my dads five. So not huge families but large. They grew up in a city in a third world country and frankly their childhood was a lot more dangerous than your imagined paranoia. Also your ideas of children are way off. We have a seven month old and we read to her, take her to the library, go to space talks, etc. Actually we do a lot more intellectual stuff now. My wife has take…

| Parks exist in most urban areas and are perfect for kids to play in. Minus the used needles and other debris that litter many of them. It’s a sad state that that’s the best place people with drug problems can go, but it seems they don’t have anywhere else to go. It’s just not where I want to bring my kid to hangout.

If it was legalized and sold retail (out of liquor stores), all these problems would go away.

Junkies would get little red sharps disposal containers, and bring it back those back in for the deposit refund. They'd stop doing it on the streets (for the most part), for the same reason you don't see raging alcoholics crowding the alleys drinking moonshine.

Drug criminalization/prohibition creates all of the problems that most people associate with drug use/addiction.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#404

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 5:21 PM UTC

1stcity3rdcoast wrote: post #61

dahfizz wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's harder than ever relative to living in the suburbs . Every day the suburbs get cheaper, more spacious, and more enjoyable relative to the city.

For you, perhaps. But for me and my family, raising children in the densest urban core is a highly enjoyable experience. Imagine never being in traffic again. Having your choice of activities, parkland, and restaurants. Hundreds of friends within a single square mile. That’s what draws many of us to the city over the suburb. But to each their own.

Restaurants that are needed because you have a tiny little galley kitchen and no garden, making it impossible to cook meals for yourselves?

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#405

Post by ssharp » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 5:30 PM UTC

raiflip wrote: post #389

asveikau wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So other than call me afraid or claim I want to monopolize opinions in the universe, have you addressed the point that a good train system is much less deadly and much less stressful than single occupant vehicles?

It's always weird how people in the suburbs complain everywhere about how crappy cities are and yet if you turn around and say you like them they get all defensive...

If you want to live in the cities, it's fine. If you want to live in the suburbs, it's fine. If you want to live in the country, it's fine.

Different people have different needs, enjoy different things, and enjoy living different ways.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#406

Post by ssharp » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 5:43 PM UTC

asveikau wrote: post #375

ssharp wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know it's okay that other people don't want the same thing as you, right? It's difficult to go anywhere without putting yourself in a "deadly metallic stress machine", whether it be a car, plane, train, boat, etc. I suppose if you have that much fear of transportation, living somewhere with ample options within walking distance is best.

So other than call me afraid or claim I want to monopolize opinions in the universe, have you addressed the point that a good train system is much less deadly and much less stressful than single occupant vehicles?

Trains are objectively less deadly than cars. I wouldn't dispute that. However, I have zero fear of being in a car. You can reduce the risk of being in a car substantially by either driving the car, or having someone drive the car, who isn't impaired, isn't distracted, and is driving defensively.

Stressfulness is much more subjective. To me, city train systems are higher stress for me than the majority of the driving I do. Granted, I rarely drive in heavy traffic, which is more stressful. Since I don't encounter that while driving, I find subways more stressful since 1) I have to plan around their schedule 2) their schedules are always subject to delays 3) I have to be around strangers in close quarters and 4) you expose yourself to a higher risk of being victim to a crime

However, I have no problems riding the NYC Subway, Chicago's L, etc. when I visiting there.

There are also other ways to avoid miles besides living in a city. For example, I have a remote job, so I don't have a daily commute.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#407

Post by asveikau » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 6:02 PM UTC

ssharp wrote: post #405

raiflip wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's always weird how people in the suburbs complain everywhere about how crappy cities are and yet if you turn around and say you like them they get all defensive...

If you want to live in the cities, it's fine. If you want to live in the suburbs, it's fine. If you want to live in the country, it's fine. Different people have different needs, enjoy different things, and enjoy living different ways.

OK, but road fatalities per capita and per automobile are higher in the US than in Europe. As is obesity. I believe that our obsession with motor vehicles even for small tasks plays a role in this.

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#408

Post by thatfrenchguy » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 6:06 PM UTC

lonelappde wrote: post #392

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you then remind them that they might need to check their biases? After all, kids learn all sorts of dubious things from "innocent" Places and well-off kids use things like drugs at a similar rate. They are simply less likely to get caught because they have unsupervised large back yards and things like that.

That opens a fun argument. "Don't worry about your white child mixing with other races, because if he ends up dealing drugs to them, it will be OK because prosecutors will blame the black kids". More seriously, preferring rich neighbors isn't rooted in racism, it's a cause of racism. Why don't you want poor people moving into your neighborhood? For the exact reason poor people want to move into your neighborhood! Bec…

To me I’d be more worried if my kids went to school only with rich white kids because they’re the ones with the money to buy coke ;-)

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#409

Post by raiflip » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 6:47 PM UTC

ssharp wrote: post #405

raiflip wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's always weird how people in the suburbs complain everywhere about how crappy cities are and yet if you turn around and say you like them they get all defensive...

If you want to live in the cities, it's fine. If you want to live in the suburbs, it's fine. If you want to live in the country, it's fine. Different people have different needs, enjoy different things, and enjoy living different ways.

+1

Re: America’s urban rebirth is missing actual births

#410

Post by clairity » Fri, Jul 19, 2019, 6:58 PM UTC

belorn wrote: post #302

clairity wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Women entered the job market due to birth control and legal changes..." the argument that dual-income households becoming necessities for home ownership and raising a family is plausible, if unsupported. but the quoted causal relationship above is not even plausible, let alone supported. women entered the job market because they wanted to realize their ambitions and support their families, just like men. other soc…

> Women entered the job market due to birth control and legal changes >> women entered the job market because they wanted to realize their ambitions and support their families From a historical perspective, women entered the job market because a world war (ww1) consumed the pool of available men through drafting them to die on the front line and having a war engine that increasingly needed more and more resources. We…

sure, women worked during the world wars out of necessity, but they didn't enter and stay in the workforce because of it.

while women working during war helped to unveil the value and abilities of women in the workforce, war didn't drive the shift to 2-income households by itself. if women had no other ambitions, they would have just gone back to "home economics" after the wars and the economy would have stayed the same.