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Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

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Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#401
post #315
post #283

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Oh, wow... when and why did that change?

Google embarked on a long mission to consolidate in the Bay Area and close small engineering offices. When Larry was the CEO he expressed his desire to have millions of engineers at Google, all in Mountain View. I can only attribute this strange desire to the fact that billionaires don’t notice housing crises and don’t have to sit in traffic. Sundar isn’t as much of a space cadet as Larry but he continues to consolid…

Your comment prompted me to do a little digging, and I found this link:

https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/blog/atlantech/2012/04/g...

I guess this office was smaller than I had thought to begin with.

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#402

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So for some context I’m a black male, early 20s who just moved to NC from CT. I’ll address 1,4, and 5 out of order and point out I don’t see their relevance to moving. If NC had particularly egregious holes in its gun laws or something, I’d understand 4, but it doesn’t. It just doesn’t have notably strong gun laws, which puts it in the majority of states. The other two are pretty inconsequential if you’re talking abo…

> It feels like what you’re saying is ... “why would an average tech worker want to move to somewhere that isn’t a spitting image of California and SV culture?” ... Expecting other places to coddle your tastes and expectations I mean, this was the topic at hand. I recognize it hurts to hear one's chosen home disparaged, but when you're trying to recruit candidates into a location, you can't exactly demand they put up…

You’re not “disparaging my chosen home” (again strongly implying to me you have a pretty narrow experience with living in different places, once you’ve lived in varied enough places you embrace the fact nowhere is perfect)

If anything you’re whining that the US isn’t a white SV techie monoculture, and it’s music to my ears...

I don’t want NC to put for or put up with SV yuppies, I want NC to grow it’s own culture that is different than its current culture, but also different from what a coddled liberal wants apparently.

There’s a difference.

This thread wasn’t “where in the South can SV run it’s Xerox machine and make San Francisco 2”.

It’s where the would an average tech worker, who FYI is not a stereotypical FAANG employee, want to settle down.

There’s plenty appealing about NC, and plenty of other places that don’t fit your narrow minded, and frankly conceited view of how the world works.

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#403

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It's debatable whether Metro will be able to handle another few tens of thousands of daily commuters going through the downtown core to get to Crystal City. The system's already crammed up at rush hour and nobody has the budget for capital improvements to start to put more tracks through Gallery Place, Metro Center, and L'Enfant Plaza. It would be interesting though, if Amazon was prepared to invest in capital improv…

Metro rideship is down from its peak, overall. The system handles over 600,000 rides per day now; it handled around 750,000 per day between 2008 and 2012. Riders commuting from downtown DC to Crystal City would be going against the prevailing flow into the city. Plenty of room on those trains in the morning. Riders in MD would have a hard time, but a person would have to be pretty dumb to move to MD for a job in Crys…

> ridership is down from its peak

Because Metro's reputation suffered when operations couldn't keep up with rising ridership. What will prevent Metro's operations from suffering again when an influx of Amazon employees stresses the system again? Would it be better if those workers got onto the already-jammed freeways?

> against the prevailing flow

Only if they board the trains between the downtown core and Crystal City. Odds are, if they're boarding from the northwest or from newly gentrified neighborhoods, they need to pass through the downtown core to get to Crystal City, which puts them on the same trains as people commuting in from the suburbs. They may get on pretty close to where the suburban commuters get off, but there's still an overlap. Not to mention the overcrowding on the downtown core platforms themselves. Keep in mind as well that Crystal City-bound trains from the downtown core stop at the Pentagon first, which has its own non-negligible share of commuters - those trains may not be full, but they sure aren't empty.

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#404

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> It feels like what you’re saying is ... “why would an average tech worker want to move to somewhere that isn’t a spitting image of California and SV culture?” ... Expecting other places to coddle your tastes and expectations I mean, this was the topic at hand. I recognize it hurts to hear one's chosen home disparaged, but when you're trying to recruit candidates into a location, you can't exactly demand they put up…

You’re not “disparaging my chosen home” (again strongly implying to me you have a pretty narrow experience with living in different places, once you’ve lived in varied enough places you embrace the fact nowhere is perfect) If anything you’re whining that the US isn’t a white SV techie monoculture, and it’s music to my ears... I don’t want NC to put for or put up with SV yuppies, I want NC to grow it’s own culture tha…

> (again strongly implying to me you have a pretty narrow experience with living in different places, once you’ve lived in varied enough places you embrace the fact nowhere is perfect)

Heh, I actually did live briefly in NC as a child. And Texas, and Georgia, and Kansas, because my father was a contract software consultant. And I've spent my career in three different states. When I chat with my former colleagues from Kansas City about recruiting, there is always a tone of defensiveness about why none of my student employees consider their companies.

> If anything you’re whining that the US isn’t a white SV techie monoculture, and it’s music to my ears...It’s where the would an average tech worker, who FYI is not a stereotypical FAANG employee, want to settle down.

Eh, it's just the uphill battle you face in recruiting. And we haven't even really touched the subject of recruiting foreign nationals. I don't particularly care much about most of the items I posted, I just wanted to offer perspective to the 'we don't need to change to recruit, the recruits need to change' crowd seen here and elsewhere.

If you want my personal justification for not moving to NC or further south, it's pretty easy: Fire Ants.

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#405

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It’s less pretentious and more that you’re just missing out on what the south has to offer. The south definitely has these negative aspects, but I argue that letting bad apples define a whole region of American is missing the forest for the trees. I likewise read headlines of mobs attacking FAANG charter busses, out of control office and apartment rents and employees living out of their cars, pervasive homelessness,…

> If Tim Cook opened a research center or similar in an SEC college town like Auburn, AL, as an example His alma mater as well.

Mine too, a guy can dream, right? Auburn may be an extreme example, but pick almost any similar college town and you get the same story

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re not “disparaging my chosen home” (again strongly implying to me you have a pretty narrow experience with living in different places, once you’ve lived in varied enough places you embrace the fact nowhere is perfect) If anything you’re whining that the US isn’t a white SV techie monoculture, and it’s music to my ears... I don’t want NC to put for or put up with SV yuppies, I want NC to grow it’s own culture tha…

> (again strongly implying to me you have a pretty narrow experience with living in different places, once you’ve lived in varied enough places you embrace the fact nowhere is perfect) Heh, I actually did live briefly in NC as a child. And Texas, and Georgia, and Kansas, because my father was a contract software consultant. And I've spent my career in three different states. When I chat with my former colleagues from…

You lived in all of these places but apparently it didn’t affect your development. Living in a place doesn’t need mean you let it change or affect you, I’ve lived in Ghana, Canada, various Western European countries and a few states, and the important part has always been being open to the culture of a place, not just being there (at a young enough age you don’t control that, but you don’t have to be that old to become more of a passive observer of your surrounding culture than an active participant)

I say that because you’re just doubling down on my point. Why do FAANG employees come into recruiting an average tech worker? In a sentence... “who needs them?”.

You seem to be in this, again, somewhat conceited, line of thought that the rest of the US combined does so little that the SV microcosm is the average of US tech and to change that you need to include the whole world (foreign nationals).

It screams this “oh what they do doesn’t count” or “you need that stereotypical FAANG guy” mentality that I see so much in trendy tech.

The average recruits don’t have to change to come to places like NC, or really places that aren’t don’t have Sillicon in their name (Sillicon Alley, Sillicon Mountsin, etc. included). All they need is an open mind.

Not the “Open to everyone in my hive mind, everyone else is not even worth communicating with” mind that I’ve seen grow strong in “trendy tech”

The recruits who think they’re being asked to change only think so because of closed minded thoughts almost all of the time.

They become so attached to this idea of an “open monoculture” that anything that isn’t their existing culture is an attack on it instead.

“How dare you try and make it change which monoculture I follow”.

NC would be a terrible place if it worked like SV because everyone would be the people who support the guy want Jews to accept Christ and repel anyone who felt differently and try and change you for not agreeing. That would be a close race, it’d be a won race.

And people who are in that “open monoculture” mindset immediately try and apply their lens to NC and see that.

At the end of the day people are coming to NC, and NC has accepted them. It’s not the place these people would project it as

(Replace NC with literally any “off the beaten path but somewhat up and coming locale that’s not a traditional ultraliberal playground)

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#407
post #157
post #29

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And to its credit, Crystal City is actually pretty rad. It’s full of highly educated people who can’t say where they work or what they do. But they do have good taste in restaurants.

I don't know. Compared to other areas around the country maybe. But with NoVA there are just better places. I remember going there twice maybe and just never had a reason to go back Crystal City. Tons of empty office space for sure though. I think proximity to DC itself is probably the main selling point.

Absolutely. Government is a huge customer for AWS. Being literally walking distance to the Pentagon is valuable.

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#408

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To be fair, pro sports are an obvious waste of valuable time and attention. Personally, I’d rather actually connect with someone (or not) than use such mindlessness as a social crutch. I don’t find the extremely common phenomenon of people who don’t like sports forcing themselves to pretend they do for career-related reasons to be particularly healthy, either.

"To be fair, pro sports are an obvious waste of valuable time and attention." Ha ha ha - this is so funny. If this comment is not satire, then I think I just made my point! I hope that readers here realize how fairly uncommon (and elitist, i.e. everyone is obviously wasting their time) this kind of statement is. Surely, a lot of people don't like pro-sports, but most are not so antagonist about it. My gosh, if you wa…

>My gosh, if you want to connect with people from anywhere, the first thing you can do is talk about sports!

Exactly the social crutch I was lamenting. This phenomenon is indeed real, and it’s pathological.

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Netflix and video games don’t directly promote tribal bullshit, and they generally don’t infect the workplace with career-impacting social expectations. I have seen the latter in various workplaces, indeed nearly all of my prior workplaces. The former is just patently true.

> Netflix and video games don’t directly promote tribal bullshit They most certainly do, at least games anyways. Clans for example have a fairly tribal sounding name.

I’ll believe this when I see riots in the streets where the local clan win a championship, and/or when spectators with no relationship to the players routinely come to blows over which clan is better.

Re: Amazon HQ2: Advanced talks about second headquarters in Northern Virginia

#410

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That plus it’s so much cheaper in DC. As someone who lives in the Bay Area but has to travel to DC a decent amount the complaints about DC housing costs are nothing compared to Palo Alto. If Amazon is putting their campus there you should buy everything you can.

I’m in pretty much the reverse position, and also bought a house recently. Any time I was feeling frustrated about the housing market here, I just pulled up a search of Bay Area properties, or talked to my California colleagues about their struggles with real estate, and I felt a lot better. This is not a cheap area by any means, but it’s far from the rarified heights of the more usual Big Tech areas.

Yeah - median housing price in Palo Alto is now 3.3 million.

I was looking at one bedroom condos in SF, but they’re around 850k to 900k for a small one.

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