User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla • Hacker News Board

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#41

Post by untitaker_ » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:18 PM UTC

soapdog wrote: post #28

Let me clarify some things: * There is no money involved in the Pocket thing. * Pocket was added internally and not as an extension because it was easier. * You don't become a Pocket user simply by using Firefox, you need to actually use the feature. * Mozilla helped Pocket create a new privacy policy * If you don't use it, then it is not doing you any harm. If somehow the presence of a button annoys you, then you ca…

This feature (or the decisions behind it) does harm non-users. Firefox devs have publicly claimed that it will replace Firefox's current reading list. Before Pocket integration, the integration of Reading List into Firefox Sync was planned, which is a end-to-end encrypted service with very strict ToS -- much stricter than Pocket's current ones: http://dustri.org/b/firefox-youre-supposed-to-be-in-my-pocke...

Claiming that no money was involved makes the situation much worse -- it implies your core values have changed.

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#42

Post by anon1385 » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:26 PM UTC

reubenmorais wrote: post #22

tajen wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least it means Mozilla has reviewed the Pocket code embedded in the browser and it doesn't send every single keystroke to GetPocket. It's good, because I don't usually install browser extensions for the very reason that I don't know what parts of my privacy I'm giving up. Btw, just a question because I'm not sure. They've reviewed the Pocket code, right?

The Pocket integration is open source, and it went through the same peer review process all code goes through before being pushed to the repositories.

Is the code on the Pocket servers open source? Can I point Firefox at my own Pocket server (or a Pocket server run by any organisation other than Pocket)?

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#43

Post by dbcooper » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:28 PM UTC

soapdog wrote: post #28

Let me clarify some things: * There is no money involved in the Pocket thing. * Pocket was added internally and not as an extension because it was easier. * You don't become a Pocket user simply by using Firefox, you need to actually use the feature. * Mozilla helped Pocket create a new privacy policy * If you don't use it, then it is not doing you any harm. If somehow the presence of a button annoys you, then you ca…

There is a privacy flaw with Web-RTC (leaks IP address for those behind a VPN or proxy):

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=959893

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#44

Post by WorldWideWayne » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:28 PM UTC

soapdog wrote: post #28

Let me clarify some things: * There is no money involved in the Pocket thing. * Pocket was added internally and not as an extension because it was easier. * You don't become a Pocket user simply by using Firefox, you need to actually use the feature. * Mozilla helped Pocket create a new privacy policy * If you don't use it, then it is not doing you any harm. If somehow the presence of a button annoys you, then you ca…

I'd rather Mozilla didn't just add third-party components via a silent update, without even giving me a choice.

I didn't complain, I didn't criticize...I simply uninstalled Firefox.

Lots of people use lots of extensions on a daily basis, but they don't give preferential treatment to those extensions. I am trusting Mozilla less and less and I'm not going to complain very loudly about it - but I am just going to leave.

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#45

Post by userbinator » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:30 PM UTC

sp332 wrote: post #9

mariusmg wrote: post #3

Mozilla is not a merry band of hackers anymore. They're a bona fida corporation with its own agenda. Their agenda depends on having as many users as possible so they're trying to make everything they can for that. The free web, choice and all that become second place now. PS : Look at their corporate HQ.

The Mozilla Corporation is completely owned by the Mozilla Foundation, a non-profit with a manifesto https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/manifesto/details/ that reads in part, "Individuals’ security and privacy on the Internet are fundamental and must not be treated as optional."

What worries me more is that freedom isn't mentioned as fundamental.

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#46

Post by sp332 » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:33 PM UTC

userbinator wrote: post #45

sp332 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Mozilla Corporation is completely owned by the Mozilla Foundation, a non-profit with a manifesto https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/manifesto/details/ that reads in part, "Individuals’ security and privacy on the Internet are fundamental and must not be treated as optional."

What worries me more is that freedom isn't mentioned as fundamental.

How could Mozilla restrict your freedom? I guess they could hire lobbyists or something but that seems unlikely.

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#47

Post by lukifer » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:37 PM UTC

soapdog wrote: post #28

Let me clarify some things: * There is no money involved in the Pocket thing. * Pocket was added internally and not as an extension because it was easier. * You don't become a Pocket user simply by using Firefox, you need to actually use the feature. * Mozilla helped Pocket create a new privacy policy * If you don't use it, then it is not doing you any harm. If somehow the presence of a button annoys you, then you ca…

"Because it was easier" is not a good reason for Pocket to be internal. It should have been an extension, which gives the user more control (ie, to completely remove the bits from the system).

I have no problem with Pocket or including by default, but the user messaging and expectations were badly mishandled. People hold Firefox to a higher standard than the other major browsers.

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#48

Post by justthistime_ » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:39 PM UTC

soapdog wrote: post #28

Let me clarify some things: * There is no money involved in the Pocket thing. * Pocket was added internally and not as an extension because it was easier. * You don't become a Pocket user simply by using Firefox, you need to actually use the feature. * Mozilla helped Pocket create a new privacy policy * If you don't use it, then it is not doing you any harm. If somehow the presence of a button annoys you, then you ca…

Some people like a browser to be a browser, not something which grows into a poorly engineered, sand-boxed, slow operating system inside of another operating system.

Sorry, I just don't trust JavaScript developers that much.

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#49

Post by tedunangst » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:39 PM UTC

soapdog wrote: post #28

Let me clarify some things: * There is no money involved in the Pocket thing. * Pocket was added internally and not as an extension because it was easier. * You don't become a Pocket user simply by using Firefox, you need to actually use the feature. * Mozilla helped Pocket create a new privacy policy * If you don't use it, then it is not doing you any harm. If somehow the presence of a button annoys you, then you ca…

> If you don't use it, then it is not doing you any harm.

I've heard that before.

Re: User feedback on Pocket submitted to Mozilla

#50

Post by Dysprosium » Tue, Jul 14, 2015, 3:40 PM UTC

The thing with Pocket is that it's basically an extension installed by default. This is the first time Mozilla does such a thing to Firefox, and this doesn't please the community, including myself.

I though that the whole point of integrating a new feature is to really implement it into the software, where you can make it efficient and reliable, where you don't rely on a third party to make it work and where users' data is bundled to their Firefox profile only.

If they think it was not worth it to implement it, then they could just label the extension "featured", make a blog post to advice it to the community and call it a day. Otherwise they can just start integrating any popular extension, call it a new "feature" and defend themselves by saying that people use it so it's important.