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Can Aging Be Cured?

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Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#41

Post by UnoriginalGuy »

ffn wrote: post #27

If we can finally cure aging, then, at long last, we will finally be able feasibly tackle inter-galatic travel and planet-level terraforming.

Considering how little progress we've made, I hardly think that our lifespans are the primary limiters in that venture. I mean you can travel to Mars in 8 months-3 years, yet we haven't.

Energy is our primary limitation right now. We have nuclear but are too afraid of launching large quantities of the raw materials into atmosphere in case of a catastrophic failure (and showering land OR sea with some heavy radioactive metal).

We also have fossil fuels which are very energy dense, but still heavy/expensive. And finally we have solar which has been a long-term popular form of spacecraft energy, but it doesn't provide enough to travel between planets YET.

Ultimately if we invented "infinite safe energy" tomorrow I don't see Mars or greater space exploration as being too big of a challenge. In particular as getting stuff into atmosphere is now energy-free, and your only limit is the cost of the raw materials.

Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#42

Post by thaumasiotes »

stcredzero wrote: post #15

In a way, we've already "cured" aging. On average, we live a lot longer than many of our ancestors. We can check many diseases and conditions that would normally kill elderly people. The problem is like cancer, in that it's not one thing, but a multitude of things. (And cancer itself is among that multitude!) Not many people, outside of healthcare workers and AIDS patients know of cytomegalovirus, but most of the pop…

> I suspect that "curing" aging will consist of extending the average lifespan a decade at a time, as we cure dozens of different conditions. Something as complex as a human body is always going to have some unforeseeable epiphenomenal mode of failure, given enough time.

There's a very foreseeable failure mode that this approach doesn't address at all.

Who'd win in a fight: a 150-pound 25-year-old guy or a 170-pound 75-year-old guy?

If you think the answer is "the 25-year-old", you've noticed a problem with aging that slowly extending lifespans doesn't solve. It's not just about whether you're alive or dead.

Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#43

Post by thaumasiotes »

zanny wrote: post #12
sillygoose wrote: post #10

Is aging a disease? :)

Its a cause of death. We like to avoid those. And we know multicellular organisms exist that can maintain their telomeres and avoid senescence. We are almost certainly going to be able to genetically engineer that into future people at some point, among a lot of other useful things. Dunno if we are going to manage to get gene therapy that can alter living humans so drastically before they die, though. And who knows w…

>> Is aging a disease?

> [It's] a cause of death.

This is not strictly true; aging is much like having AIDS -- it lets actual causes of death come in and kill you. Nobody ever died (directly) of AIDS, and nobody's ever died of old age either.

Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#44

Post by joeyspn »

Didn't know about this guy (Aubrey de Grey) but googling for him I just learnt that's he's 52.. From that vid I thought he was a sleep-deprived 30-something!

Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#45

Post by jakejake »

agumonkey wrote: post #21
sillygoose wrote: post #10

Is aging a disease? :)

Sometimes I feel we should cure living. I would prefer to live only 70 years but fully, having built good human relationships, knowing how to learn, rather than 100 unfulfilled ones.

Most young people, including myself, do tend to think they would like to live until X years of age. Getting to know some older people, though, it's interesting how we tend to see things differently when we live that many years. I know quite a few people in their late 60s and I think they have Many good years left to enjoy their hard-earned retirement, watch their kids and grandkids grow up, or is some cases continue to do great work.

Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#47

Post by Retra »

imaginenore wrote: post #17
dTal wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which can be decomposed into not taking the cure by choice (suicide) and being deprived of it forcibly, which can be further decomposed into negligence (accident) or malice (murder).

That's like saying shooting yourself in the head is just an allergic reaction to lead.

I can't see the comparison...

Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#48

Post by Retra »

mkagenius wrote: post #40
kolinko wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might be mistaking cause for a reason here.

No no, cause would be something like length of telomere being short or something. The reason (evolutionary reason) would be that nature needs to clear the previous generation in order to make room for a newer and better generation.

Evolution doesn't work like that. You don't consider newer generations 'better', you consider the survivors better. So you're assuming your conclusion and burying it in human moral terms, which evolution has no obligation to apply.

Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#49

Post by agumonkey »

jakejake wrote: post #45
agumonkey wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes I feel we should cure living. I would prefer to live only 70 years but fully, having built good human relationships, knowing how to learn, rather than 100 unfulfilled ones.

Most young people, including myself, do tend to think they would like to live until X years of age. Getting to know some older people, though, it's interesting how we tend to see things differently when we live that many years. I know quite a few people in their late 60s and I think they have Many good years left to enjoy their hard-earned retirement, watch their kids and grandkids grow up, or is some cases continue…

Ha, I hope I didn't sound like I rejected being 'old' or ageist. I too grew up[1] to be very fond of people of any age and love their perspective and experiences (or lack thereof)[2]. Nor to take away people opportunity to enjoy their closed ones. But I've seen many times broken lives out of misunderstandings that weren't related to biology or aging. When you're almost unable to relate to your family or couldn't build one, you have other things to improve rather than aging.

[1] although very late, maybe on average it's a coming of age thing.

[2] being into computer and technology, I think we have a special relationship to fads, newness, communication and history that makes us (at least I) interested in others in weird ways. How people managed to solve problems or live in a different context, what was the same, what really changed for them as a human.

Re: Can Aging Be Cured?

#50

Post by mkagenius »

Retra wrote: post #48
mkagenius wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No no, cause would be something like length of telomere being short or something. The reason (evolutionary reason) would be that nature needs to clear the previous generation in order to make room for a newer and better generation.

Evolution doesn't work like that. You don't consider newer generations 'better', you consider the survivors better. So you're assuming your conclusion and burying it in human moral terms, which evolution has no obligation to apply.

Newer generation is supposed to be better at least thats what genetic cross tries to do, pass on the better/survivor genes to next generation.
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