Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#41

Post by bcg1 » Fri, May 22, 2015, 7:06 PM UTC

ChuckMcM wrote: post #35

In general, re-implementing a software product from open specifications has been protected by the courts. There are numerous examples, from the original IBM BIOS to Microsoft BASIC to PostGres and BSD Unix. That said, the Google case is casting a shadow on programatic APIs, but 'look and feel' are essentially fair game. What are protected and protectable are Trademarks. So using the word 'Slack' in the name or anythi…

I'd like to add... the key test for trademarks is whether or not the use will cause confusion in the marketplace as to the origin of the product.

So calling something "Open Slack" would almost assuredly not be fair game... while claiming that the product is "mostly compatible with the Slack API" would probably be fine, especially since it almost self-evidently implies that the product is not Slack.

In any case, best to tread lightly with the use of their name at all, and certainly don't use it for marketing or promotion. Unlike patents and copyright, the only way to obtain and keep a trademark is to use it and defend it, so companies are rightfully aggressive in that regard.

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#42

Post by alazar » Fri, May 22, 2015, 7:06 PM UTC

Host it in China and advertise directly to their current customers.

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#43

Post by ohitsdom » Fri, May 22, 2015, 7:58 PM UTC

joeyspn wrote: post #14

What technologies did you use? XMPP? Node? ... I don't think your are infringing any copyright as long as you are not making profit from it. Reverse Engineering is legal, specially when done with the aim of interoperability... and what you are seeking is an interoperable server right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_engineering#Legality

Profitability has nothing to do with determining copyright infringement. For example, if I made a soda called Coke+ and gave it away for free, I'd still be infringing.

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#44

Post by charlesdm » Fri, May 22, 2015, 8:10 PM UTC

No clue where you're based, but in the EU, this is legal. You are allowed to replicate and reverse engineer systems, as long as you do not use the original source code.

APIs/functionality/data models/etc can't be copyrighted (again, in Europe). See http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2012-05-02/copyright-....

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#45

Post by [deleted] » Fri, May 22, 2015, 8:19 PM UTC

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#46

Post by [deleted] » Fri, May 22, 2015, 8:20 PM UTC

sysk wrote: post #11

desdiv wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>APIs themselves aren't copyrightable, as we saw in Google's recent lawsuit. The most recent ruling said that APIs, by themselves, are copyrightable[0]. The case is back to the district court now to determine whether the wholesale copying and reimplementation an API falls under the fair-use defense. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oracle_America,_Inc._v._Google...

Depressing indeed. Are there any other open source projects that are API compatible with a proprietary product/service? Is it ethical? I feel like it is but would be interested to hear HN's opinion.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#47

Post by dmourati » Fri, May 22, 2015, 8:24 PM UTC

IP can be broken down into its constituent parts. Patent, Copyright, trademark, and trade secret. The rules for each are different and sufficiently complex that the question should be treated as these four parts.

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#48

Post by toomuchtodo » Fri, May 22, 2015, 8:26 PM UTC

onyxraven wrote: post #39

sysk wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, interesting question. I had never implemented a chat server before and initially read the IRC/XMPP specifications but Slack felt like a "superset" of both (federation/p2p wasn't a priority for me) and I was more familiar with web protocols. The stack is Node.js and PostgreSQL (I probably reinvented some kind of message queue). There is a "dumb" websocket server that just receives/sends events from/to the backend…

Fun. From everything noted about Slack, thats all they've got as their 'core' as well (PHP/MySQL I think, with maybe nodejs websockets).

https://twitter.com/SlackHQ/status/500007057937145856

https://twitter.com/SlackHQ/status/521894442064560128

https://twitter.com/SlackHQ/status/458391373994270720

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#49

Post by tzury » Fri, May 22, 2015, 8:37 PM UTC

For a solid advise, talk to a lawyer.

Re: Ask HN: I wrote a Slack compatible server. Can I open source it?

#50

Post by a-dub » Fri, May 22, 2015, 9:27 PM UTC

Slack is pretty much just IRC with an indexer, a pretty web interface, a mobile interface and a bunch of of cool datafeeds/bots. These things aren't hard to build, and many people build them internally in companies all the time.

Their value proposition isn't the technology, their value proposition is the packaging. It all just works. People actively maintain the interfaces and the GUI. They have ops teams that keep it up. The integrations are maintained and are literally plug and play. You can pretty much just sign up and within an hour its all done for not much money.

For these reasons, I have doubts as to whether or not they'd mind, regardless of IP concerns.