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Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

calacanis.com

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Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#41

Post by barake »

pavlov wrote: post #16
jacquesm wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$1 is too much. The startups are looking for funding, not spending it on maybe-I-will-hook-up-events with no guarantee of even individual attention. These are just scams, avoid them completely. One product/project launch vote on HN will get you more in terms of actual attention from the right people than one of these events. Let's turn this around: Who active on HN found investment through an event like this? (Maybe…

I don't know about the US situation, but in Europe, the investors who go to these events tend to be non-savvy local angels. Actually, a better way to describe them might be "hobby investors": moderately wealthy people who are thinking about putting this year's vacation money into a startup instead. In exchange for something meaningless like 20k€, they'll want to meddle in the company's strategy and expect regular rep…

It is a very similar situation where I am in the Midwest/Southern US. Most "investors" are doctors/lawyers/etc that think investing in a startup is an alternative to the stock market.

Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#42

Post by frankdenbow »

mattdeboard wrote: post #28
frankdenbow wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had a similar experience in Dublin but the rest of the conference they produced was very good (great speakers, well produced). There wasn't enough foot traffic to justify the cost and travel expenses for a startup booth. They should drop the fees for startups.

> They should drop the fees for startups My impression is startups paying their fees is their business model

Its not the only way they make money, though (sponsorships and ticket sales for regular attendees)

Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#43

Post by heliodor »

Some people run conferences as cold-blooded businesses while other people run conferences from the (partial or total) goodness of their heart.

This is what Calacanis wanted to say but ended up resorting to the "scam" word. He claims he's the latter and WebSummit is the former.

The comparison to the government's warnings for the modeling industry is not a good one. The government warning is about bait-and-switch, where you go in for a modeling interview but instead it's a sales pitch for products. The conference thing doesn't sound like a bait-and-switch, but rather just a bad deal.

Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#45

Post by jasonmcalacanis »

downandout wrote: post #24
bruceb wrote: post #14

The question is how do you create enough financial incentive for organizer to put on a quality conference without charging startups? I don't mind paying a small fee, after all a lot of effort goes in to putting on a conference but clearly there are those charging "too much" (of course that is subjective). Calacanis's Launch cost $450 a table for 3 days with discount code. For those who attend this year or last how di…

>Calacanis's Launch cost $450 a table for 3 days with discount code The fact that you are asking this means this post was a very good example of sponsored content. He makes a legitimate point, then spends the second half of the article advertising his own stuff. Classic negative review tactics - bash your competition and then pitch yourself. As for these conferences in general, I don't understand why it is so hard fo…

Well, I don't actually have to bash the competition... as I'm not competing with anyone -- I lose money or breakeven and sell out every time!

It's easy to sell out when you have 60,000 emails and you give every founder a free ticket. :-)

Also, I didn't start this whole discussion, I was reacting to folks who were bashing these other events. Those founders felt duped, not me.

Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#46

Post by jasonmcalacanis »

jacquesm wrote: post #39
pavlov wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about the US situation, but in Europe, the investors who go to these events tend to be non-savvy local angels. Actually, a better way to describe them might be "hobby investors": moderately wealthy people who are thinking about putting this year's vacation money into a startup instead. In exchange for something meaningless like 20k€, they'll want to meddle in the company's strategy and expect regular rep…

That's very accurate from my personal experience. I'd add that they also tend to have totally irrational expectation with respect to the return-on-investment.

Note: the worst angel investor you could ever have is someone who is doing it a "hobby."

Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#47

Post by jasonmcalacanis »

chrisbennet wrote: post #36
bruceb wrote: post #14

The question is how do you create enough financial incentive for organizer to put on a quality conference without charging startups? I don't mind paying a small fee, after all a lot of effort goes in to putting on a conference but clearly there are those charging "too much" (of course that is subjective). Calacanis's Launch cost $450 a table for 3 days with discount code. For those who attend this year or last how di…

Sounds like if you are poor startup it's free. (175 out of 225 were free). Seems fair and not a bait and switch. Calacanis states in the article: "At the LAUNCH Festival this year we gave 11,000 of the 12,000 attendees FREE TICKETS. We also gave away 175 of the 225 demo pit tables for free. We sell some at cost as well ($1-3k). Our model is to charge the companies who have money, and give them some time on stage to b…

Correct. We will let folks buy trade show tables and exhibitor booths through the front door. I have no problem with a funded company that is selling to our audience to buy a table.

I mean, if you're selling a SaaS product that has an average LTV of $5,000 it's probably good idea to spend 2-5x that on a sponsorship for our events (or someone else's) because, well, you'll make it back!

The issue we are talking about here is people "applying" to be in a competition to "get exposure to angels," and then being "accepted" for a fee. That's just lame.

I'm a lucky bastard in that I have the chip stack to take on the risk of a $1m+ budget event, get the support of the top sponsors in the industry and be able to give everyone free tickets and tables.

Remember, Mike and I fought to kill the DEMO conference ($20k to present!) and then he sold to AOL and they decided to maximize profit. I decided to minimize profit -- in fact, my goal is to net out to ZERO each year and give back MORE AND MORE.

Why?

I believe the angel investor who gives away the most value gets into the best deals.

The SCALE conference is going to be free for 2,500 of 3,000 seats. http://calacanis.com/2015/04/29/welcome-to-scale/

Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#48

Post by jasonmcalacanis »

nakedrobot2 wrote: post #2

Web Summit and Paddy Cosgrave, I'm looking at you here. This is their mode of operation exactly. They fooled me out of 1000 euro and packed me in like sardines with a bunch of other poor fools. It's a bad memory of a huge, overcrowded, scammy event where the only winner was the organizers. And their formula seems to be working which is the most depressing part.

If Paddy wants to do this right he should just be up front: $1,000 a table is not outrageous in my mind. If you get rid of this "apply to present" then surprise people with a bill, you would not have this bad will from so many founders.

Note: I didn't actually bring all this up, I was just responding to all the folks writing about Keiretsu forum and Collision. While I do have a conference, it doesn't compete with any of these other events -- because winning for me is just giving back as much as I can (and taking NOTHING).

I do these events for my own intellectual curiosity, to help my founders get exposure and to find new founders to invest in.

I wish Paddy the best with his events and I hope the Keiretsu forum folds.

Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#49

Post by jasonmcalacanis »

bruceb wrote: post #14

The question is how do you create enough financial incentive for organizer to put on a quality conference without charging startups? I don't mind paying a small fee, after all a lot of effort goes in to putting on a conference but clearly there are those charging "too much" (of course that is subjective). Calacanis's Launch cost $450 a table for 3 days with discount code. For those who attend this year or last how di…

Note: We give 175 of 225 tables away for free based on merit (we look for unfunded, or angel funded companies that are doing cool shit).

We let anyone buy tables through the front door -- no application or anything. We have a ton of bigcompanies and profitable SaaS companies who want to reach the 12,000 folks who come to LAUNCH Festival and the 3,000 coming to LAUNCH Scale in the fall.

Re: Avoid the “Apply to Present” and “Angel Pitch Contest” Event Scams

#50

Post by benisaacson »

Come on people, these event/forum producers are marketers and so are you. Your job is to ask the right questions and decide whether it's worth the ROI. Break it down; 1) Speaking? Who/how many in the audience - press? 2) Exhibiting? Who/how many attendees 3) Networking? Who is going to be there and can you hustle relevant meetings in advance/on-site? 4) Cost= Start with your CPM for #1/#2 just like any ad spend, then calculate what the # of quality meetings from all of the above could mean to your ROI at the event. If you converted only 1 client, 1 decent press report, or 1 great investor follow up--is that enough ROI for time/$$?

I bit the bullet on Collision, and can't say whether we'll get ROI from #2 or #3 - but I will say they teased and totally f'ed us out of our #1. I still give them credit for being awesome marketers, and love that they give you the quantifiable metrics you need since they published every speaker, investor and media attendee which I've never seen done at any event in the past.

Completely agree with others on Kereitsu - I can't believe they charge startups what they do and have done so for so long. It's really sad not just for startups, but for the novice investors who believe they need Kereitsu for dealflow/co-investments. Really hope platforms like Angelist and new ones following RegA implementation (May 25th!) will change this.

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