Fundable comes to an ugly end • Hacker News Board

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#41

Post by chops » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 6:02 AM UTC

wmf wrote: post #26

megaduck wrote: post #9

As my cofounder and I are currently finalizing our own incorporation, I look at Fundable's sad situation and think, "Wow. What if that were us? Is there any way we can avoid ever having that kind of situation with a clever bit of legalese?" Unfortunately, I suspect the answer is "no". As soon as you give one partner the ability to eject the other (for whatever reason), you open the door for all sorts of abuse. Beside…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shotgun_clause

Thank you for that link. I'd never heard of that term before, but that's a pretty fascinating mechanism.

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#42

Post by drusenko » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 6:22 AM UTC

mquander wrote: post #5

vaksel wrote: post #4

Louis Helm programmed the the payment system. if this is an indication of their attention to detail, it's probably a good thing they had to close before they lost their user data to some hackers. Based on what was written, I'd be surprised if both "founders" aren't 18. edit: googled, and found some photos(Pratt looks to be ~26, while the coder guy does indeed appear to be ~16: http://emilychang.com/e/go/ehub/intervie…

> After John Pratt contacted Louis Helm's father, Louis Helm called John Pratt and agreed that his actions were immature. 16 sounds more likely.

Did either of you read the interview? They both graduated from the University of Michigan...

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#43

Post by sachinag » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 6:25 AM UTC

patio11 wrote: post #30

sachinag wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They were. Ivan's now at Facebook, where everyone assumes he's working on Facebook Payments. Abby's probably doing something even cooler, although IDK. BTW, Tipjoy never held the money; they were just a front-end for PayPal, so they didn't have the issues that Fundable apparently is having.

Tipjoy never held the money That does not match with my understanding of their business model. http://tipjoy.com/faq Look for their instructions on, e.g., cashing out.

I guess I only read it early on and didn't see the change. Building a totally new payment system is actually rather impressive.

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#44

Post by pvg » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 6:30 AM UTC

eplanit wrote: post #19

I'm torn between 'sad' and 'pathetic'. The word 'immaturity' applies, without question or hesitation.

No need to be torn, it's both (and more). Obviously, it's sad when your venture fails; writing a long rambling missive (in the third person) about how you called your partner's parents and how everyone should sue your partner, though, is pathetic. Could have simply said the company is shutting down, that one of the founders is no longer able to work on it and provided a contact address for people who need to recover their money.

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#45

Post by maxied » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 6:31 AM UTC

wheels wrote: post #6

I have to really ask, "Why is this upvoted so much?" There aren't really lessons in here; it's just bitter drama.

This saddens me as well, as I was hoping this independent financing model would succeed.

But I definitely see a few lessons here: 1. The need to have performance/milestone based equity sharing vs blindly giving a person 50% based on their POTENTIAL. 2. The need to have a checks and balance system that places control of the domain/trademarks in hands other than the programmer or developers. That way the person controlling the domain can have some control, while the developer has other control (passwords, access). And a third party/person who may control the finances. (Domain/Trademarks/Copyrights)+technology+finances. Like the checks and balances of Legislative+Executive+Judicial systems. 3. The need to repair or remove faulty systems/people at the first signs of unreliability.

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#46

Post by olefoo » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 7:35 AM UTC

drusenko wrote: post #40

vaksel wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

they are incorporated, so he himself isn't liable, the corporation's assets may be seized, but he should be fine

unless, of course, they didn't do everything by the book, in which case the corporation could be found null and void and both could be personally liable.

If one of the officers of the corporation told paypal to lock the account that could be enough to pierce the veil of corporate liability if any of the parties owed money cannot retrieve their funds because of that.

This just sounds like a bad deal all the way around. If the two partners are as erratic as they now appear to be. I can't imagine that they were particularly fastidious when money was flowing in.

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#47

Post by mseebach » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 7:42 AM UTC

vaksel wrote: post #4

Louis Helm programmed the the payment system. if this is an indication of their attention to detail, it's probably a good thing they had to close before they lost their user data to some hackers. Based on what was written, I'd be surprised if both "founders" aren't 18. edit: googled, and found some photos(Pratt looks to be ~26, while the coder guy does indeed appear to be ~16: http://emilychang.com/e/go/ehub/intervie…

> found some photos

You could also skim the article on the page with the photos and look for any biographical information...

The Fundable team is made up of Louis Helm and John Pratt.

Louis, Fundable’s software architect, studied Computer Science Engineering at the University of Michigan. He is co-author of the Seventeen or Bust distributed computing project (seventeenorbust.com), which recently discovered the largest known non-mersenne prime number with the help of 5000+ users. He worked as a software engineer at Jabil Circuits before leaving to work on Fundable full-time.

John graduated in Political Science at the University of Michigan last December, where he worked for the university’s paper as a photographer. He also studied at the University of Havana, Cuba in 2003. John programs, designs and writes documentation for Fundable’s pages.

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#48

Post by adamsmith » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 8:01 AM UTC

megaduck wrote: post #27

wmf wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shotgun_clause

A shotgun clause is probably the best method out of a bad lot, but it still has the potential for abuse. If a partner is going through financial difficulty (outside of the company), then the partner with a better financial position can force a sale at a depressed valuation. Say my mother has a massive stroke and requires expensive ongoing medical care. After a while, I'm financially drained. At that point, my partner…

In theory given enough time you could go to investors and raise cash (binding in the event that your bid wins) backing a bid. It's the job of investors to allocate capital, after all.

Of course, I realize that theory does not always match reality.

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#49

Post by wehriam » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 8:17 AM UTC

wheels wrote: post #6

I have to really ask, "Why is this upvoted so much?" There aren't really lessons in here; it's just bitter drama.

There are lessons here! But no matter what your conclusion, I'd rather crash and burn than fade away. Cheers to Fundable and to making a stir.

Re: Fundable comes to an ugly end

#50

Post by piramida » Fri, Oct 02, 2009, 8:42 AM UTC

Could not resist a laugh really, this is so childish. That's why I would not put any trust in an online business without knowing it's background - can as well be two boys in a basement.