Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#41

Post by megablast » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:20 AM UTC

DannyBee wrote: post #16

jkubicek wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought he was pretty clear when he said > If it actually doesn’t do much more, or allow much more, than what they demonstrated on stage last week, I am indeed going to be deeply disappointed, and I’ll be concerned about the entire direction of the company as a whole. But I get the impression that they’ve only shown us the tip of the functional iceberg, simply because they wanted to reveal the hardware — particular…

"He thinks Apple is holding some details close to the vest and he has a plausible reason for why. Say what you will about Gruber's Apple partisanship, but he's always been great at reading between the lines of Apple's publicity events." And he also thinks that no android wear device manufacturer is doing the same, for no plausible reason. He's basically saying "apple has secret plans, they are awesome" and "Nobody el…

Well, since most of the Android devices have been released and are out there, not sure what they are waiting for in releasing whatever they have?

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#42

Post by bane » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:22 AM UTC

swang wrote: post #38

"The iPad/iPhone is soooo egalitarian!" "Is Apple losing the egalitarianism it never had? No, it had Macs, it was never egalitarian!" Why was this in the article at all then? Using an analogy that in the end the author itself destroys is bad writing, or at worst extra reading for the reader for no gain. In his own article he never considers Apple egalitarian, yet he is asking a hypothetical question as though Apple w…

Gruber deserves a prize of some sort of most concentrated example of cognitive dissonance ever put into writing for this post. It's really one of the worst of the worst I've seen.

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#43

Post by bane » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:26 AM UTC

w1ntermute wrote: post #26

tlipeep wrote: post #4

Gruber bends over backwards and twists himself in knots trying to explain why he isn't disappointed after considering the expectations he set before the event. I don't see anything different in the AppleWatch functionality compared to what he criticized Android Wear for earlier this year

I honestly don't understand why Daring Fireball hasn't been banned on HN. Gruber is just an Apple shill.

May as well just redirect to Apple press releases on the same topic whenever a Gruber post gets submitted. It would be an interesting NLP problem to figure out what subject he's talking about and automatically find the appropriate Apple press release to redirect to.

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#44

Post by rtpg » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:30 AM UTC

Kylekramer wrote: post #28

My impression of Android Wear is that it’s best thought of as a wrist-worn terminal for your Android phone and for Google’s cloud-based services. An extension for your phone, not a sibling device. Android Wear devices are almost useless other than for telling time when out of Bluetooth range from your phone. I don’t think that’s a device that many people want; it’s a solution in search of a problem. I don't see how t…

> don't see how the overall point doesn't equally apply to the Apple Watch.

This is something that nobody seems to want to acknowledge in (for lack of a better word) the Apple fanclub.

If you look at the features of the Apple watch, they are basically the same as every other smartwatch released by Samsung and motorola (except for the NFC/Apple Pay stuff, which I am genuinly excited for).

People are trying really hard to differentiate Apple Watch from the Android watches, but it all sounds so absurd because they are so similar (apart from the home screen zoom-UI). Even Apple made their watch square!

And we know that Android Wear kind of sucks. So if they're not that different, Apple Watch will probably not be that great.

The "digital crown" input mechanism is interesting. The Watch seems to have a crisp (tiny) screen. And the wrist bands look cool. But unless there's going to be some crazy battery in there, there's nothing revolutionary about this, and its functionally the same as the 6 watches that Samsung has released, and will probably be almost as underwhelming.

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#45

Post by bobbles » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:31 AM UTC

Kylekramer wrote: post #28

My impression of Android Wear is that it’s best thought of as a wrist-worn terminal for your Android phone and for Google’s cloud-based services. An extension for your phone, not a sibling device. Android Wear devices are almost useless other than for telling time when out of Bluetooth range from your phone. I don’t think that’s a device that many people want; it’s a solution in search of a problem. I don't see how t…

A major part of the article discusses the fact that if this applies to the Apple Watch he will be disappointed.

He is expecting developments between now and release (ie. more information) to demonstrate that this is not the case.

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#46

Post by craigching » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:33 AM UTC

Kylekramer wrote: post #28

My impression of Android Wear is that it’s best thought of as a wrist-worn terminal for your Android phone and for Google’s cloud-based services. An extension for your phone, not a sibling device. Android Wear devices are almost useless other than for telling time when out of Bluetooth range from your phone. I don’t think that’s a device that many people want; it’s a solution in search of a problem. I don't see how t…

> I don't see how the overall point doesn't equally apply to the Apple Watch. Playing music via Bluetooth only

But Gruber says this:

> It has internal storage and Bluetooth, so you’ll be able to use it for music playback without taking your iPhone with you.

Is Gruber wrong about that? I admittedly don't know, but he sounds authoritative here that the Apple Watch has storage for tunes. That's pretty cool to me.

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#47

Post by blinkingled » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:33 AM UTC

tlipeep wrote: post #9

jkubicek wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought he was pretty clear when he said > If it actually doesn’t do much more, or allow much more, than what they demonstrated on stage last week, I am indeed going to be deeply disappointed, and I’ll be concerned about the entire direction of the company as a whole. But I get the impression that they’ve only shown us the tip of the functional iceberg, simply because they wanted to reveal the hardware — particular…

That's wishful thinking from Gruber so he can withhold judgement/criticism. Apple clearly demonstrated the fundamental functionality of their Watch and the hardware does determine the software — they have a hardware button dedicated to one particular feature ffs. Any additional functionality via WatchKit will at best be supplemental. It'd take a while for iOS developers to get to grips with the new paradigm. Furtherm…

Spot on. As is typical of Gruber he is conveniently missing the fact that Android Wear updates come straight from Google - i.e. the barrier to software side of innovation is almost non-existent compared to Android phones. There is nothing in hardware or software innovation and differentiation that the OEMs and Google cannot add down the line.

There is really no merit to this article at all - it comes across as a series of bending, twisting, confusing hogwash that tries to get you to somehow believe that Apple has gotten everything right and if they haven't gotten something right they surely have secret plans to get it all right. (There is one consistent thing with Gruber - he conveniently ignores or otherwise pooh poohs facts that get in his way. Apple didn't state battery life numbers and Moto 360 battery life is widely varied in the reporting - ranging from half a day to 40 hours - but that doesn't stop him from claiming Apple Watch will run throughout the day irrespective of usage and Moto 360 will top out at half a day! Given his emphasis that Apple is doing more with the watch than competitors and given the physical limitations the claim that it will last a day no matter how you use it - is dodgy a best.)

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#48

Post by elblanco » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:34 AM UTC

pinkyand wrote: post #25

tlipeep wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's wishful thinking from Gruber so he can withhold judgement/criticism. Apple clearly demonstrated the fundamental functionality of their Watch and the hardware does determine the software — they have a hardware button dedicated to one particular feature ffs. Any additional functionality via WatchKit will at best be supplemental. It'd take a while for iOS developers to get to grips with the new paradigm. Furtherm…

> AndroidWear OEMs are iterating faster with a wider range of options. That's the critical point.Both ecosystems are starting from a similar point. AndroidWear is iterating faster. And since watch apps are probably much simpler to build than phone apps, we'll probably won't see a big difference between the app ecosystems. And there's probably little that can be patent protected. Probably the only difference would be…

Android wear is basically on gen 2 or 3. By the time Apple's Watch actually comes out they'll be on Gen 4 or 5. The iteration in Android land is breathtaking right now. And I think the devices (phones) at the mid and high end are basically better and fill many more niches than Apple's stuff.

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#49

Post by XorNot » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:35 AM UTC

freshyill wrote: post #22

51Cards wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, I don't see any decent percentage of even the high end market investing that much in a watch that will be largely obsolete in 2 years tops. You buy a Rolex to have it for years and pass it down. A $5000 watch that no one will want in 2 years is not a wise investment.

Even if the electronics are obsolete, you've still got a chunk of gold hanging off your wrist. Gruber mentions this, and raises the possibility of trade-ins. They do it with phones, and it makes sense for watches made of solid gold.

The only way you could make this work would be to make the electronics swappable out of the chassis, to give the object some sort of historical permanence for the owner.

Of course, if you could do that though, then you're not really in the smartwatch business, since it would mean anyone could make compatible wrist-bands.

Conversely - that might not be a bad business to be in.

Re: Apple Watch: Initial Thoughts and Observations

#50

Post by elblanco » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 2:36 AM UTC

rtpg wrote: post #44

Kylekramer wrote: post #28

My impression of Android Wear is that it’s best thought of as a wrist-worn terminal for your Android phone and for Google’s cloud-based services. An extension for your phone, not a sibling device. Android Wear devices are almost useless other than for telling time when out of Bluetooth range from your phone. I don’t think that’s a device that many people want; it’s a solution in search of a problem. I don't see how t…

> don't see how the overall point doesn't equally apply to the Apple Watch. This is something that nobody seems to want to acknowledge in (for lack of a better word) the Apple fanclub. If you look at the features of the Apple watch, they are basically the same as every other smartwatch released by Samsung and motorola (except for the NFC/Apple Pay stuff, which I am genuinly excited for). People are trying really hard…

> And we know that Android Wear kind of sucks. So if they're not that different, Apple Watch will probably not be that great.

that's really the salient point isn't it? Apple's playing catchup, but shooting for targets that probably aren't all that great to begin with.