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New York’s Shadow Transit

newyorker.com

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Re: New York’s Shadow Transit

#41

Post by prawn »

thrownaway2424 wrote: post #37
prawn wrote: post #33

This sort of thing will be handled by autonomous vehicles in the future, potentially plotting an efficient route based on people needing a ride and their respective destinations. With an app and even 1-2 of the right vehicles, someone could effectively enter the public transport space whereas doing so now would require a salaried driver on top of that and bring pricing that would be too high for ride-sharing.

Did you even read the article? Half of the dollar van experience is the opportunity to connect with your own immigrant community and speak your native language. It's a social experience that silly technogadgets can't replace.

Yes, of course I did but I think it's as much about convenience and filling gaps in official routes as it is about the social experience.

Awareness (in the absence of formal route maps and schedules) comes from the community but not only because of it. If you arrived in a country and someone said "Check out this app, it's available in your language on most phones, the vehicles can go where you want to go and you'll never have trouble with language issues," it's not as though a majority will ignore that.

We'll see high traffic lines operated much as they are (trains and larger buses) but I definitely think we'll eventually see automated vans operated within the gaps as these vans do.

Re: New York’s Shadow Transit

#44

Post by lazerwalker »

Blackthorn wrote: post #38
jgiger2014 wrote: post #4

It seems *similar unlicensed busses are gone now: http://www.fastcompany.com/1839333/business-lessons-chinatow...

I never understood how those unlicensed "Chinatown buses" managed to survive anyway. Their fares weren't any cheaper than their licensed (and FAR safer) brethren in Megabus.

The likes of Megabus and BoltBus didn't exist before the Chinatown busses became popular. They were all spun up by the big old-fashioned bus companies as competition after they realized there was a market there. BoltBus, for example, is run by Peter Pan and Greyhound.

Re: New York’s Shadow Transit

#45

Post by kiwidrew »

WildUtah wrote: post #16

This is a great story. It's a look at how people really live in a modern city and the border between formal and informal commerce. One of the key research targets in modern sociology and economics and political science is the emergence of institutions like dollar vans. It's very difficult to get a public system to cover every route and part of the city that needs transit, but most city authorities are reluctant to li…

Hong Kong has thousands of minibuses, which are -- surprisingly -- more expensive than the bus or subway, but can often be twice as fast. (In part because they are notorious for driving dangerously.) The drivers and vehicles are actually licensed these days, but in almost all aspects they still operate in a very "informal" way; there's no route maps, for instance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_light_bus

Re: New York’s Shadow Transit

#46

Post by jonemo »

sparkman55 wrote: post #32
_delirium wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you considered the other popular transit option in international cities, riding a bike? In Copenhagen you do not cover 2km distances by Lyft, Uber, or a bus, because 2km is such a trivial distance you just bike it yourself in a few minutes. And yes, even if you have two kids and groceries with you— because cargo bikes are common and easy ( http://daneshea.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/IMG_10731.jpg ).

Yes! Caltrain is actually very accommodating to bicyclists, with no extra charge for bikes and special bike cars (that are often full at peak hours). I personally bike about a mile to a train station in Palo Alto, and about a mile from Caltrain to the office in San Francisco. However, San Francisco has some fundamental problems that make it less hospitable to biking than Copenhagen. It is notoriously hilly, and doesn…

> Caltrain is actually very accommodating to bicyclists

Unless they leave you stranded because they are "full" of bikes. Like most non-local trains during rush hour.

Re: New York’s Shadow Transit

#47

Post by comrh »

My team for the National Day of Civic Hacking worked on similar data. One of the things we came across was the lack of reliable schedules and a lack of info in Spanish which is the language of a large number of people who use this system.

Re: New York’s Shadow Transit

#49

Post by Spooky23 »

It kind of glossed over the safety issuers associated with these forms of transit. Life is good until there's an accident.

My brother inspects commercial vehicles. These vans and Chinatown busses are often unmaintained and owned by shell companies. IIRC, he takes half of the vans off the road for serious safety violations, and 75% of the busses. Traditional busses and licensed vans almost never have that happen.

Re: New York’s Shadow Transit

#50

Post by kamaal »

WildUtah wrote: post #16

This is a great story. It's a look at how people really live in a modern city and the border between formal and informal commerce. One of the key research targets in modern sociology and economics and political science is the emergence of institutions like dollar vans. It's very difficult to get a public system to cover every route and part of the city that needs transit, but most city authorities are reluctant to li…

Any major Indian city has this kind of informal unregulated public transit system, which is a pretty big business. Nothing fancy and cozy like those Vans though. But you will see 7 seater auto rickshaws, Tempo travelers, Vans, and discarded old second had buses given some make up and reused.

The price is generally lower than the government public transport system buses.

I was/am generally a frequent user of these means of transport. Largely because of the price and frequency of availability and they just work. They will even stop by places the metropolitan buses wouldn't give a stop. The city outskirts have this almost as their default means of transport. I've even been autos with goats and calves.

One more great thing about such buses is they generally stop at places where there are a lot of hawkers. So you can also get to buy cheap shirts, socks, slippers, FM radios, miscellaneous toys and other cool stuff. Which are also like some kind of a under ground market, they operate evading and running from the police- Generally when they get caught a bribe of 100-200 rupees comes handy.

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