Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest • Hacker News Board

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#41

Post by mseebach » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 2:41 PM UTC

anu_gupta wrote: post #2

I don't really understand why people would use Uber in London when services like Hailo exist. A black cab is going to get you around London much faster than a car that can't use bus lanes, there are many more cabs available than Uber cars, and I would guess (without knowing) that a cab is going to be cheaper. So, apart from Uber maybe having some nicer cars available, what's the deal?

So:

- Nicer cars (I don't how that's an afterthought to be brushed away)

- Cheaper (by a good margin)

- There are more than twice as many private hire cars than taxis in London - although, they're not all on Uber, by a huge margin. I "top up" with Kabbee when Uber falls short. (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachm...)

- Not too proud to use sat nav (A major selling point for taxis is that they have "The Knowledge" which, in a way, is impressive, but ragingly annoying when they don't happen to know the place you're going and you have to provide turn-by-turn navigation).

- Private hire cars don't have an industry association that calls the competition rapists (This weekend, Regent Street. On my way to grab an Uber. https://www.dropbox.com/s/2qqmy7sldbax6xk/20140426_232545.jp... )

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#42

Post by mickeyp » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 2:42 PM UTC

basicallydan wrote: post #34

anu_gupta wrote: post #2

I don't really understand why people would use Uber in London when services like Hailo exist. A black cab is going to get you around London much faster than a car that can't use bus lanes, there are many more cabs available than Uber cars, and I would guess (without knowing) that a cab is going to be cheaper. So, apart from Uber maybe having some nicer cars available, what's the deal?

It is cheaper, but I see your point. There's something to be said for the Knowledge, which in case any readers here don't know, is what it sounds like. London Black Cab drivers have comprehensive knowledge of London's streets which allows them to get around very quickly compared to many minicab drivers including Uber cars. They have to have this to get their licence to drive a black cab.

Yeah and just as many of those cab drivers are prone to hectoring you when you tell them which way to go... especially when they take a longer route under the guise of it "being quicker." They're also completely reckless and drive like maniacs -- unless they have a passenger, in which case you'd think they were transporting Faberge eggs: coming to slow, rolling stops and being slow to catch green lights.

They're also prone to be "on their way home" and thus, "not going in the direction you're going" if you want to go some place that is unlikely to get them a fare back into central.

Any competition against these over-priced monopolists is a good thing in my book. Yes they have 'the knowledge' and yet I still find myself giving them directions to where I want to go.

(Still, they're better clued-in than a sketchy minicab driver; but then, that bar is set rather low.)

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#43

Post by theorique » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 2:44 PM UTC

beatpanda wrote: post #25

danso wrote: post #20

This does not seem like a well-planned marketing campaign. Uber and its competitors would've done well enough on pure demand alone without having to say anything. But now they've decided to (inadvertently or not) jump into labor politics, which will almost certainly be interpreted as an effort to sap the strike of its power...and this effort will be associated particularly with the affluent who are wealthy enough to…

This isn't the first time Uber has scabbed during a transit strike. They're openly hostile toward organized labor.

It's not scabbing if it's a totally different service. Would a guy riding a pedicab be scabbing? Am I scabbing if I offer my neighbor a drive to work during a transit strike?

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#44

Post by awda » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 2:52 PM UTC

masklinn wrote: post #22

awda wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presumably Uber is paying the drivers the difference.

Presumably Uber will have a 4x surge during the strike.

They'd still have to pay the extra to drivers, and it would be larger than at 1x surge... unless their overhead is more than 50%?

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#45

Post by untog » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 3:16 PM UTC

mseebach wrote: post #41

anu_gupta wrote: post #2

I don't really understand why people would use Uber in London when services like Hailo exist. A black cab is going to get you around London much faster than a car that can't use bus lanes, there are many more cabs available than Uber cars, and I would guess (without knowing) that a cab is going to be cheaper. So, apart from Uber maybe having some nicer cars available, what's the deal?

So: - Nicer cars (I don't how that's an afterthought to be brushed away) - Cheaper (by a good margin) - There are more than twice as many private hire cars than taxis in London - although, they're not all on Uber, by a huge margin. I "top up" with Kabbee when Uber falls short. ( https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachm... ) - Not too proud to use sat nav (A major selling point for taxis is that th…

- Nicer cars (I don't how that's an afterthought to be brushed away)

It isn't, but London cabs are far from uncomfortable, and most people don't have long journeys. It's factor, but I struggle to see it as an important one.

Private hire cars don't have an industry association that calls the competition rapists

That's not really calling the competition rapists. It's not even specifically talking about the competition you're talking about - the danger is unlicensed cabs and drivers who are not certified.

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#46

Post by mseebach » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 3:25 PM UTC

untog wrote: post #45

mseebach wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So: - Nicer cars (I don't how that's an afterthought to be brushed away) - Cheaper (by a good margin) - There are more than twice as many private hire cars than taxis in London - although, they're not all on Uber, by a huge margin. I "top up" with Kabbee when Uber falls short. ( https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachm... ) - Not too proud to use sat nav (A major selling point for taxis is that th…

- Nicer cars (I don't how that's an afterthought to be brushed away) It isn't, but London cabs are far from uncomfortable, and most people don't have long journeys. It's factor, but I struggle to see it as an important one. Private hire cars don't have an industry association that calls the competition rapists That's not really calling the competition rapists. It's not even specifically talking about the competition…

> It's not even specifically talking about the competition you're talking about - the danger is unlicensed cabs and drivers who are not certified.

The headline on the article says "minicabs" which is specifically the competition I'm talking about and whose drivers are licensed and certified.

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#47

Post by jsingleton » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 3:34 PM UTC

basicallydan wrote: post #29

jsingleton wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even at normal times I've found it much quicker to walk than take a taxi. I've beaten colleagues to venues on multiple occasions. I wish these cab apps would use their power to try to improve the air quality in London. Offering incentives to low emission vehicles or those with scrubbers. Or just giving users the choice. BTW I made a really simple tube strike info site: http://www.isthetubeonstrike.com/

Oh hi James! I agree, but to be fair they do at least use Priuses for UberX. In a gridlock, they'll probably be fairly harmless ;) I actually have used UberX before in London, at a fairly quiet time but when I was in a rush and it was great. I'd recommend it for that kind of situation, especially if you're not in a taxi hunting ground.

I'll send you an email. :)

http://www.greentomatocars.com/uk/ look quite good. Not used them though.

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#48

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 4:02 PM UTC

michaelt wrote: post #23

danso wrote: post #20

This does not seem like a well-planned marketing campaign. Uber and its competitors would've done well enough on pure demand alone without having to say anything. But now they've decided to (inadvertently or not) jump into labor politics, which will almost certainly be interpreted as an effort to sap the strike of its power...and this effort will be associated particularly with the affluent who are wealthy enough to…

Uber seems to like getting into politics. I suspect they see the resulting press coverage as free advertising.

[deleted]

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#49

Post by fomb » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 4:22 PM UTC

untog wrote: post #7

fomb wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black cabs generally require cash. Whilst they may advertise they take card, most drivers don't like it due to the lead time on getting the money through.

Hailo (and competitors) let you use cards, and the drivers seem pretty happy about it.

I'm referring to using Cabs direct. I realise Hailo is via card.

Re: Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

#50

Post by Yossarian_Lives » Mon, Apr 28, 2014, 4:24 PM UTC

johanneskanybal wrote: post #11

SF startups disrupting working class demonstrations, that will go down well, you are fired pete.

I don't know if you're a Londoner, but for what it's worth, I think Uber's promotion (poorly conceived and worded as it is) won't be read that way in London. The tube workers are split between a number of unions, the TSSA, ASLEF and the RMT, of which only the RMT is participating in this latest strike (previous strikes this year have been cross-union). Also important to note is that the RMT had been led by Bob Crow for the past 12 years until he died suddenly in March. Under his leadership, the RMT was very aggressive with its strike action in comparison to the other unions, but that policy successfully boosted its tube driver members to an average salary of £52,000/pa ($87,400/pa). And even though he was a hate figure for much of the right-wing press during his lifetime, on his passing there was a consensus of sorts that he had been exceptionally good at his job and was actually well-regarded by his opposite numbers at Transport for London (who run the tube) as tough but a pragmatist.

This latest strike takes place in the shadow of the battle to succeed Bob Crow at the RMT. Tactically, it could undermine the union, as TfL will be able to keep a significant part of the network operational. However, none of the candidates for the leadership of the Union can oppose it for fear of being tarred as a management stooge by their rivals. Of course, that's not to say that both the TfL and even the other unions won't benefit if this strike proceeds and ends up being a damp squib.

All of which is to say, as working class demonstrations go, this one's something of an edge case. I'm pro organised labour but I think this particular strike is going to damage the cause more than it helps -- if the RMT is painted as reckless users of their strike power, the (right-of-centre) government will have an easier time either making it harder to strike (in terms of forcing minimum participation thresholds) or even the nuclear option of making the Tube an essential service, which would put its workers in the same position as the Police, Army and prison officers, who are legally barred from striking.