Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm • Hacker News Board

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#41

Post by riffraff » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 9:58 PM UTC

grey413 wrote: post #22

geuis wrote: post #12

How closely related are the two species. Hybrids between species of horses and cats are common. Same for canines. But it didn't occur to me that wheels and goats are that closely related

Goat and sheep lineages diverged approximately five to eight million years ago[1]. For reference, human and gorilla lines diverged roughly six to eight million years ago[2]. Also, different breeds of dogs are considered the same species (and likewise with cats). [1] http://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/docs/00/89/44/91/PDF/hal-008... [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_evolutionary_genetics#Div...

I believe GP meant canine (wolves and dogs) and felines (tiger and lion) which interbreed "frequently".

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#42

Post by grey413 » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:01 PM UTC

Steuard wrote: post #38

giardini wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Humans and gorillas? What about our ancestors and those of pigs? I found this hypothesis fascinating: "A chimp-pig hybrid origin for humans?" http://phys.org/news/2013-07-chimp-pig-hybrid-humans.html from the article: " I asked McCarthy if he could give a date estimate for the hybridization event, he said that there are a couple broad possibilities: (1) It might be that hybridization between pigs and apes produced th…

That's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read. We've done genetic studies on humans and apes, and we share some huge fraction of our genome with them (99%+, right?). It's quite telling that in this era of abundant genetic data, this guy bases all of his arguments on anatomical similarities and says nothing about genetics. It's all but impossible that a link like what he's suggesting would have been overlook…

The champion of the theory attributes the lack of genomic similarity to repeated back-crossing to one of the parent populations. To put it in other words, the droplet of initial hybridization got diluted in the larger gene pool, but the novel genes (and thus traits) remained and underwent selection.

That being said, diluted gene contribution is not the same thing as no gene contribution. To even begin accepting such a theory I would require direct genetic evidence showing considerable horizontal gene transfer between porcine and hominid lines.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#43

Post by mildtrepidation » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:03 PM UTC

logfromblammo wrote: post #11

Better name it Swapfile, because clearly this system doesn't have enough ram.

This comment is perfect, in that it simultaneously gets my goat and pulls the wool over my eyes.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#44

Post by mildtrepidation » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:06 PM UTC

Revex wrote: post #9

api_or_ipa wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"bio-hacking": is this what we call genetic engineering now?

Hacking != Engineering

Unless you go by recent popular usage, in which case every possible interaction with anything that is not specifically laid out in that thing's accompanying instruction manual is now considered "hacking." Case in point: Life has no instructions, so people happily call almost anything "life hacking."

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#45

Post by saalweachter » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:07 PM UTC

giardini wrote: post #25

grey413 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Goat and sheep lineages diverged approximately five to eight million years ago[1]. For reference, human and gorilla lines diverged roughly six to eight million years ago[2]. Also, different breeds of dogs are considered the same species (and likewise with cats). [1] http://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/docs/00/89/44/91/PDF/hal-008... [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_evolutionary_genetics#Div...

Humans and gorillas? What about our ancestors and those of pigs? I found this hypothesis fascinating: "A chimp-pig hybrid origin for humans?" http://phys.org/news/2013-07-chimp-pig-hybrid-humans.html from the article: " I asked McCarthy if he could give a date estimate for the hybridization event, he said that there are a couple broad possibilities: (1) It might be that hybridization between pigs and apes produced th…

Basically, no.

While goats and sheep diverged 8 million years ago, humans/chimps and pigs diverged 80 million years ago. The last time a proto-chimp got with a proto-pig, the T-Rex hadn't evolved yet. While goats and sheep have a difference of 6 chromosomes, chimps and pigs have a difference of 10. McCarthy, despite being a geneticist, makes his absurd claim without even discussing the genetic difficulties.

What little similarity there is between humans and pigs is simply a case of convergent evolution.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#46

Post by dang » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:23 PM UTC

Revex wrote: post #2

While I find this fascinating, it does seem a bit curious to post this in a hacker forum. I was half way expecting to read that the farmer had been "bio-hacking" trying to come up with a healthy hybrid.

The only sins on Hacker News are being uninteresting and being rude. If PG can post about the margins of medieval manuscripts, anything interesting goes.

Given that the top comment in the thread is a relevant (and deservedly upvoted) quotation from a late-Renaissance text, I'd say we're doing pretty well here.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#47

Post by hasbeen » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:33 PM UTC

jhprks wrote: post #40

Goat and a sheep? that's disgusting... just totally inhumane for farmers to allow something so horrible to happen... I'm really worried about the future of the human society, what next? a dog and a cat? a human being and a chimpanzee? bunch of perverted maniacs deface what it means to be human, to be pure beings under name of Jesus Christ, we should all repent for our sins to the lord and the savior who created us 60…

Love it! I started to get pissed off at the beginning then as I read I started to laugh out loud! As a farmer Ireland, I was really surprised to see this on here. It was like taking a coffee break from work!

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#48

Post by adamnemecek » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:36 PM UTC

geuis wrote: post #12

How closely related are the two species. Hybrids between species of horses and cats are common. Same for canines. But it didn't occur to me that wheels and goats are that closely related

> Hybrids between species of horses and cats are common.

I was really confused for a second there.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#49

Post by dang » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:37 PM UTC

eps wrote: post #29

@lacero - you are hell-banned

Lacero is not "hell-banned" or any other kind of banned. Lacero's comment came from an IP that had been caught by a spam filter. I just unbanned the IP and unkilled the relevant comments.

Please don't claim things on or about Hacker News that you can't possibly know are true. Concerns about dead comments and anything else about HN can be sent to hn@ycombinator.com.

Edit: I deleted things that were too harsh.

Re: Rare 'goat-sheep' born on Irish farm

#50

Post by hasbeen » Fri, Apr 04, 2014, 10:38 PM UTC

I hope people actually listen to the interview, some of the quoting can be taken out of context. I'm from an Irish framing background, and wasa little scared of the way this might be taken. I think it is worthy of hn, looking at things from a difference prospective but i quietly hope it doesn't rank high.