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Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

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Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#41

Concerning that they ask you computer science questions when you will be working on the front end. What if you were to ask CSS and Javascript questions to a DBA? Do you see how absolutely ridiculous that sounds?

More ridiculous than asking CS questions of a front end dev. I'm a self-taught front-end dev who has flunked numerous interviews because of a lack of CS degree and being able to get through the sorting algorithm questions. I then went home and have spent lots and lots of time teaching myself those fundamentals, if only to interview better. Those fundamentals have made me a vastly better front end dev, able to efficiently solve problems I wouldn't have been able to solve a year ago.

I have had the exact same experience with the author of the article regarding a total absence of actual front-end related questions, though. Not sure how to feel about not getting those gigs.

Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#42
I interviewed at a well-known place here in Portland and they seemed really disappointed that I didn't already know Rails. That was surprising to me, since like the author, I am more familiar with the mindset that you prefer smart people rather than people who know technology X. Beforehand I spent all this time reviewing data structures, algorithms, etc, but they just cared about Rails. I also got one of those goofy OO-design questions about Human inherits from Animal. Not at all what I was expecting.

Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#44

One problem is that many people associate front-end development mainly with HTML and CSS. HTML and CSS are not programming languages. I say this a front-end developer who has to write HTML, CSS and JavaScript on a daily basis. Yes, strictly speaking, HTML and CSS may be considered programming languages, but they lack control structures, design patterns and other interesting tenants of computer science. Like the autho…

> strictly speaking, HTML and CSS may be considered programming languages, but they lack control structures, design patterns and other interesting tenants of computer science.

They are non-Turing-Complete programming languages, and part of that is having limited control structures. "Design patterns" aren't a language feature, have nothing to do with being a programming language (architecture has design patterns -- in fact, that's where the term comes from), and CSS and HTML both have design patterns (and piles of books describing them.)

> As more sites gravitate toward complex JavaScript-driven web apps, it may be useful to ditch the general term "front-end," differentiating C.S.-oriented front-end developers from those who prefer visual design.

There's already a distinction commonly made between "front-end developers" vs "designers". What more do you think is needed?

Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#45

One problem is that many people associate front-end development mainly with HTML and CSS. HTML and CSS are not programming languages. I say this a front-end developer who has to write HTML, CSS and JavaScript on a daily basis. Yes, strictly speaking, HTML and CSS may be considered programming languages, but they lack control structures, design patterns and other interesting tenants of computer science. Like the autho…

Post author here. I agree 100% that HTML and CSS are not programming languages. However, any application that you build on the front-end is going to require your JavaScript code to interact with the HTML and CSS, so a solid understanding of how all the pieces fit together is crucial.

I can't tell you how many times I've seen back-end engineers hack together a 100+ line JavaScript solution to a problem when one line of CSS would have fixed it.

If you don't know CSS, HTML and DOM very well, then you're probably going to be over-engineering your front-end apps.

Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#46
I had a similar experience with a well known bay area company. I was interviewing for a front end job and they gave me a live coding interview with a recursion question about assembling trees from strings (or maybe vice versa).

I had spent the majority of my time preparing for the interview preparing for front end stuff. I stuffed my brain with Javascript quirks and made sure that the stuff I already knew I could articulate really well. And I gave myself a quirk algorithms review because I knew that is something the Bay Area values.

I struggled with the first question. They asked me if I was interested in a non-dev job because apparently they liked my personality and thought I may be a good cultural fit. It struck me as odd that they liked me enough to inquire if I'm interested in other positions, but only gave me one chance to show them I could be a frontend candidate and the sole interview question wasn't even frontend oriented.

Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#47

Concerning that they ask you computer science questions when you will be working on the front end. What if you were to ask CSS and Javascript questions to a DBA? Do you see how absolutely ridiculous that sounds?

Well, given the new trend of fat JS clients, if you have no clue about algorithmic complexity, you can fairly easily end with a very sluggish application, even under Chrome.

I don't expect from a front-end engineer to just drop random jQuery plugins on top of each others.

Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#48

It could have been a sign that they trusted your front-end skill. If I know someone has a skill, I don't waste my time interviewing them to prove it. I try to figure out what else they can do, where they can grow, and how well they would fit in with the team. So I'd pose the question back to you -- did you provide them a portfolio or any code samples that would have made the front-end questions redundant?

Yes, I provided a detailed resume as well as my Github account for all of these. The problem is it didn't seem like the individual interviewers had taken much time to actually look at what I'd done. If they had, then maybe I'd agree with you, but it seemed like many of them were just going through the motions. It seemed like they interview people all the time.

"It seemed like they interview people all the time."

I bet you hit the nail on the head.

At my current job, I've had weeks where I've been on an interview loop every day. At that point, I'm not going to spend much time looking at your github code in depth beforehand each day. Especially when it's a candidate whose area of expertise isn't the same as mine, so I wouldn't know what to look for. Ideally we'd be better able to match interviewers with interviewees, but if we had enough people to be doing that, we wouldn't be in the mad hiring rush that ends up with a developer doing five interviews in a single week around career-fair season. ;)

(My last job was a much smaller company where each hire was weighed a lot more, and we absolutely would've looked at all that stuff there.)

However, I always start off asking about a specific project from the candidate's resume, usually the one that I think sounds most interesting to me. Depending on how long they take to explain it, or how interested they seem to be in explaining it, I'll follow up with a more open-ended question of what their most interesting or challenging project was -- if you can sell me on that project, it's just as big an influence on me me as the coding or design question that I'd also ask.

But I have coworkers who don't ask about other projects like that, which I think kinda sucks.

Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#49
As a follow-up to my earlier comment, i'm doing a phone interview right now and the first interviewer started off with questions about how IIS internals worked and some obscure C# questions. I immediately asked him "Is this a front-end position or not? I know C# and .net MVC but i'm focusing my career on Angular" his reply "I honestly don't know, they just told me to call you and ask you a series of questions on advanced C# development" Job posting title "Senior Frontend Developer with AngularJS"

Re: Interviewing as a Front-End Engineer in San Francisco

#50

One problem is that many people associate front-end development mainly with HTML and CSS. HTML and CSS are not programming languages. I say this a front-end developer who has to write HTML, CSS and JavaScript on a daily basis. Yes, strictly speaking, HTML and CSS may be considered programming languages, but they lack control structures, design patterns and other interesting tenants of computer science. Like the autho…

> strictly speaking, HTML and CSS may be considered programming languages, but they lack control structures, design patterns and other interesting tenants of computer science. They are non-Turing-Complete programming languages, and part of that is having limited control structures. "Design patterns" aren't a language feature, have nothing to do with being a programming language (architecture has design patterns -- in…

> What more do you think is needed?

Hiring managers knowing the difference...

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