Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Cursive Clojure: A Clojure IntelliJ plugin

cursiveclojure.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 61 posts

Re: Cursive Clojure: A Clojure IntelliJ plugin

#42

Post by pron »

lemming wrote: post #40
pron wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I assume you'd want to see those in the Lein toolwindow? Exactly. Good plugin BTW. I like the jump to Java code (I work on a mixed Java/Clojure project), and was very happy to find out that renaming a Java method fixed the Clojure calls, too. And find usages works across languages! Keep up the good work! EDIT: One problem I've found: If a function is defined not with defn but using a macro that expands to defn, the…

Thanks, glad you're liking it! Any issues, let me know. There's still a lot to do but it's very usable right now.

Added an issue above.

Re: Cursive Clojure: A Clojure IntelliJ plugin

#43

Post by lemming »

andrewcooke wrote: post #39
lemming wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This will be commercial, similar to PyCharm, RubyMine and the other JetBrains IDEs. I'm considering a slightly restricted free edition that can't be used for commercial work, but I haven't worked out the details yet. It almost certainly won't be fully open source, but I'm considering having a small closed source core and then the majority of the Clojure implementation being open source and extensible. This will need…

how does that work if it's a fork of la clojure? are you paying intellij? did they licence their code under a very open licence?

Yes, they released their code under the Apache license. I checked with them before deciding to go ahead with this and they didn't have a problem with the idea.

Re: Cursive Clojure: A Clojure IntelliJ plugin

#44

Post by lemming »

edem wrote: post #41

Why not Eclipse? 65% of java developers use it. Only 9% uses IntelliJ. Just asking.

For a couple of reasons. One is that there's already a great Clojure environment for Eclipse - Counterclockwise. Secondly, I think that IntelliJ provides a better platform for building something like this - it's just a better IDE all round in my opinion, and it's a great infrastructure to build on.

I suspect that you'd probably find that the percentage of Java devs using IntelliJ has gone up a lot in recent years too, their market share and mindshare has increased massively recently. I'm not aware of any stats though (and I'm not sure how accurate they would be if there were). Google recently switched from Eclipse to IntelliJ for the official Android development environment, for whatever that's worth.

Re: Cursive Clojure: A Clojure IntelliJ plugin

#45

Post by vutekst »

AndreasFrom wrote: post #19
kul_ wrote: post #18

can it be integrated with vim?

I often hear good things about IdeaVim. I don't think that's want you meant, but I just wanted to throw it in there.

I use IdeaVim every day for java work. It's okay, but it's a pretty shallow emulation, and I frequently miss things from real vim.

Re: Cursive Clojure: A Clojure IntelliJ plugin

#46

Post by lemming »

pron wrote: post #38
lemming wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's still some lein functionality I need to add. Currently the best way to add a non-standard task like lein midje is to create a run config (Run->Edit Configurations..., hit + and select Leiningen). I'm going to be improving this soon - I assume you'd want to see those in the Lein toolwindow? Drop me an email if that doesn't do what you need it to.

> I assume you'd want to see those in the Lein toolwindow? Exactly. Good plugin BTW. I like the jump to Java code (I work on a mixed Java/Clojure project), and was very happy to find out that renaming a Java method fixed the Clojure calls, too. And find usages works across languages! Keep up the good work! EDIT: One problem I've found: If a function is defined not with defn but using a macro that expands to defn, the…

Yeah, that defn problem needs a whole blog post - damn macros.

Re: Cursive Clojure: A Clojure IntelliJ plugin

#48

Post by 6cxs2hd6 »

lemming wrote: post #46
pron wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I assume you'd want to see those in the Lein toolwindow? Exactly. Good plugin BTW. I like the jump to Java code (I work on a mixed Java/Clojure project), and was very happy to find out that renaming a Java method fixed the Clojure calls, too. And find usages works across languages! Keep up the good work! EDIT: One problem I've found: If a function is defined not with defn but using a macro that expands to defn, the…

Yeah, that defn problem needs a whole blog post - damn macros.

Although you've probably thought about this more than I have, it seems like there's a fundamental tension here. On the one hand there are Java IDEs and code-generation in the sense of (re)writing physical source code files. On the other hand, there are lisp macros in the sense of "an API for the compiler". Fully embracing the latter can obviate much of the need for the former (at least there's a long lisp tradition of this).

But it seems that the Java interop aspect of Clojure complicates this picture. The JVM poking through isn't inherently good or bad (for some people that interop is an advantage, for others it's unfortunate), it's just different from other lisps.

So the point I'm ponderously getting around to making is -- it seems like this IDE will be most useful for people using Clojure as a JVM lang, as opposed to using it as a lisp per se. Would you say that's a reasonable characterization, or not?

Re: Cursive Clojure: A Clojure IntelliJ plugin

#50

Post by pron »

6cxs2hd6 wrote: post #48
lemming wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, that defn problem needs a whole blog post - damn macros.

Although you've probably thought about this more than I have, it seems like there's a fundamental tension here. On the one hand there are Java IDEs and code-generation in the sense of (re)writing physical source code files. On the other hand, there are lisp macros in the sense of "an API for the compiler". Fully embracing the latter can obviate much of the need for the former (at least there's a long lisp tradition o…

If I could weigh in, I don't see why one has anything to do with the other. Many people enjoy using IDEs regardless of what language they're using. Historically, the case has been that statically typed languages benefitted more from an IDE, because there is less ambiguity in symbol resolution (functions or methods are known, typed entities, rather than a string). BTW, Clojure is similar to statically typed languages in that respect in that its dispatch mechanism uses namespaces, so symbol "foo" is well known (either as a function, a macro, a multimethod or a protocol method) symbol in a specific namespace, so that you can easily find its usages or jump to definition.

But even languages with more ephemeral dispatch (Ruby, Javascript, Groovy) can benefit from an IDE. It's often convenient to have an editor, a debugger, and control over the build in a single program (and that's why emacs is an IDE).

So I don't see any connection between IDEs and the JVM. Some people enjoy IDEs and some don't.

Post reply on HN