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Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

teslamotors.com

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Re: Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

#41

Post by mncolinlee »

noname123 wrote: post #23

The reason why Tesla is able to pay the Dept of Energy loan early is because of a secondary stock and bonds offering worth about >850+ million. In another words, Tesla is raising funds by generating more debt (from bondholders) and diluting share value (from shareholders), roughly about 3.5 mil out of 40 mil float, and using that money to pay the US govt. TSLA rose on the news despite diluting shareholders is because…

There's something bizarre about griping that they reached profitability from green credits. To clarify, these green credits were voluntarily paid by OTHER CAR COMPANIES like Fiat who did not innovate enough to develop their own green cars. In essence, these credits work similarly to carbon credits or sulfur credits. They are NOT paid by taxpayers or by the government in any way.

It was a capitalist regulation in California designed to provide financial incentives and produce more revenue for innovative green companies. Companies have the option to develop their own green cars, buy credits, or else cede the California market to competitors. Those incentives have been very successful. There are far more new models of low and zero emissions vehicles than ever before.

Remember the popular Saturn EV-1 from fifteen years ago? It and other green vehicles were killed because California removed its regulations mandating production of low emissions vehicles.

Re: Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

#42

Post by skore »

lanstein wrote: post #5

"This program is often confused with the financial bailouts provided to the then bankrupt GM and Chrysler, who were ineligible for the ATVM program, because a requirement of that program was good financial health." "ONLY AMERICAN CAR COMPANY TO HAVE PAID BACK GOVERNMENT" I'm not so sure Elon isn't writing his own copy.

Both can be true at the same time. The second statement you quote does not specify the program which was paid back.

Re: Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

#43

Post by gjm11 »

deelowe wrote: post #28
veritas20 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's crazy to see that a "red" state, you know the champions of free-market and capitalism, would support such laws that restrict any manufacturer from selling directly to consumers. The obstacles being thrown in Tesla's path from the dealership associations fly in the face of capitalism and free enterprise. Before Tesla, I wasn't aware that these types of laws existed.

Who said republicans support a truly free-market?

Republicans.

Re: Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

#44

Post by encoderer »

Nrsolis wrote: post #34
noname123 wrote: post #23

The reason why Tesla is able to pay the Dept of Energy loan early is because of a secondary stock and bonds offering worth about >850+ million. In another words, Tesla is raising funds by generating more debt (from bondholders) and diluting share value (from shareholders), roughly about 3.5 mil out of 40 mil float, and using that money to pay the US govt. TSLA rose on the news despite diluting shareholders is because…

If I take a step back from this, I'd say it's bad strategy to bet against Elon Musk. IMHO, part of what makes his companies appealing is that he has a remarkable track record of keeping his head down and just getting sh!* done. I'm very impressed with his work ethic and vision and I think Tesla is going to go far. Secondly, if he is successful and manages to bootstrap and entire electric car industry from the ground…

Musk had very little to do with PayPal. He built a competing product, X.com, which was acquired by PayPal. Musk then served as CEO and if his interview in "Founders at Work" is any indication, he didn't do much besides piss off Max Levchin before stepping down after a relatively short tenure.

I love what Musk has done post PayPal, but no reason to rewrite history here.

Re: Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

#46

Post by Uhhrrr »

dragonwriter wrote: post #37
Uhhrrr wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GM was in trouble long before the 2008 crash: http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2008/06/general-motors-deat... (in June 2008, they were already up to part 181 in their series) Also, guaranteed loans for automakers might be excellent compared to other government policy, but given that Ford didn't take a loan, and there are many foreign companies which didn't need loans, the existence of any benefit from subsidizing mor…

> Also, guaranteed loans for automakers might be excellent compared to other government policy, but given that Ford didn't take a loan, and there are many foreign companies which didn't need loans, the existence of any benefit from subsidizing more poorly-run automakers is questionable. FWIW, Ford's CEO disagreed, which is both why he went to Congress in 2008 to argue for the bailout, and defended the bailout in 2012…

Well yeah. The bailout terms were heavily slanted towards the unions. Of course Ford preferred the bailout to competing against some company which might buy all the assets at bankruptcy prices and then hire workers on much more favorable terms.

Re: Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

#48

Post by pbreit »

noname123 wrote: post #23

The reason why Tesla is able to pay the Dept of Energy loan early is because of a secondary stock and bonds offering worth about >850+ million. In another words, Tesla is raising funds by generating more debt (from bondholders) and diluting share value (from shareholders), roughly about 3.5 mil out of 40 mil float, and using that money to pay the US govt. TSLA rose on the news despite diluting shareholders is because…

> selling each car at a material loss

Is that true? I know the company overall would not have turned a profit without the credits but was under the impression that they currently had positive gross margins on the Model S.

Re: Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

#49

Post by rayiner »

snprbob86 wrote: post #4

The subtitle says: "ONLY AMERICAN CAR COMPANY TO HAVE PAID BACK GOVERNMENT" Assuming that's true, I'm not sure whether I should be proud of Tesla, ashamed of our Government, or angered at other car companies. Probably all three...

Who ever pays back the government for stuff? It's largely besides the point. The government didn't bail out say GM because it wanted to get a return on its investment. It did so because of the fear that letting Detroit go bankrupt would have a domino effect that would leave a gaping crater in employment. If the car companies manage to pay back the government, great. Even if they don't, that wasn't really the point.

Re: Tesla Repays Department of Energy Loan Nine Years Early

#50

Post by lanstein »

skore wrote: post #42
lanstein wrote: post #5

"This program is often confused with the financial bailouts provided to the then bankrupt GM and Chrysler, who were ineligible for the ATVM program, because a requirement of that program was good financial health." "ONLY AMERICAN CAR COMPANY TO HAVE PAID BACK GOVERNMENT" I'm not so sure Elon isn't writing his own copy.

Both can be true at the same time. The second statement you quote does not specify the program which was paid back.

I'm just referring to the tone :)
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