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Samsung is hurting Android

trustedreviews.com

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Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#41

Post by georgemcbay »

emanuer wrote: post #7

The Samsung software I have seen on their TVs, laptops, phones has been adequate at best. I wish them best of luck developing another closed ecosystem. However their track record of developing good, functioning software is not very promising. When you use Apple products everything is tied into Apple. I didn't like some parts of their ecosystem (Itunes). It is all or nothing for Apple, so I said farewell and moved on.…

I agree. I've ranted previously about how Samsung is toxic for Android in the past, mostly because they really did copy Apple too much, which gave the impression that "Android" (since Samsung is a very popular Android device provider) copied Apple too much.

eg: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4346221

The problem is that whenever they don't blatantly rip-off Apple the designs they come up with are terrible. And beyond just design they're clearly lacking on the software quality front.

Exhibit A, The easy root exploit via /dev/mem:

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2048511

Exhibit B, the copy bug where copying more than 20 items in a single device session would break copy/paste across the entire device, causing any app which tries to access the clipboard to crash. The bug they didn't fix for close to a year (they never really fixed it per se, they just waited until the normal Android system OS refresh cycle and didn't include the bug in the next revision) and whose "workaround" was doing a factory reset of your device once it got into that state (you could also fix it by rooting the device and manually deleting some protected files but of course that wasn't officially supported).

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2013/feb/22/samsung-cop...

As someone whose current job involves Android development, it is nearly impossible for me to avoid Samsung's terrible devices (95% of the time they are the ones I have to investigate device specific bugs on in our app) despite the myriad of problems I have with them.

The only Samsung device I've touched that is tolerable to use is the ARM Chromebook, presumably because they had virtually nothing to do with the software on it.

Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#42

Post by deweerdt »

czhiddy wrote: post #22
megablast wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Samsung have a lot of money, and a lot of resources to through behind making their software work better. I find it hard to believe that is that hard to get right. If they had any sense they should buy BB or Palm OS.

Software is hard. Any company where you can ship production code with all of physical memory mmap'able world-readable/writable (Exynos Android 4.0 vulnerability) points to a seriously flawed software engineering culture.

I thought this was more due to the 'embedded' culture. After all, under VxWorks, isn't all memory addressable by all processes?

Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#43

Post by [deleted] »

czhiddy wrote: post #22
megablast wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Samsung have a lot of money, and a lot of resources to through behind making their software work better. I find it hard to believe that is that hard to get right. If they had any sense they should buy BB or Palm OS.

Software is hard. Any company where you can ship production code with all of physical memory mmap'able world-readable/writable (Exynos Android 4.0 vulnerability) points to a seriously flawed software engineering culture.

[deleted]

Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#44

Post by igravious »

Oletros wrote: post #27

The exclusive deal last until August 31 http://www.engadget.com/2013/05/09/samsung-itv-player-androi...

You appear to be the sole voice of sanity. The Trusted Reviews article is a badly written illogical pile of mish-mash. And you can quote me on that. I've read most of the comments here as well and they're well wide of the mark. Android is here to stay, Samsung are not going to make any headway with Tizen. Firefox OS does not stand a chance in my opinion, though I admire their efforts. I still use Firefox the browser and I have tons of respect for the Mozilla Foundation. It's a win-win for open-source either way.

Google is doing what Microsoft should have done years ago but couldn't because it wasn't in its DNA. Android is Linux folks, don't forget that, Google is the steward at the moment but anybody can fork it if Google starts behaving badly. A whole consortium could get together. I really wish people would quit with the griping and conspiracy theories and appreciate what Google have done. It's unprecedented and I salute them. And to prove I'm not a total fanboy, I'm writing this from a Macbook, not a Linux box, and I own a HTC One X. I say hats off to Google and Samsung and HTC and Motorola and Huawei and whoever jumps on board. Every sale of Android is another vindication of the open-source model and I wish them all well.

Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#45

Post by danmaz74 »

MatthewPhillips wrote: post #31
bjustin wrote: post #18

>The exit strategy is called Tizen. I see two major issues with Samsung switching to Tizen: * Samsung is unlikely to get developers as talented as those at Google. I doubt that Tizen development could approach mainline Android's development pace, given the talent difference. * Tizen would need its own app store. Ask BlackBerry or Microsoft how well new app stores do. Tizen is unlikely to catch up with Android functio…

Android's development pace is slowing down, as is iOSes. Smartphones are not an innovative platform any more. It used to be that OSes got major new features like universal voice dictation, universal search, and turn-by-turn navigation, but in the last couple of years the two major platforms have been getting very iterative improvements; performance upgrades, visual polishes, proprietary assistant apps... That's becau…

and not many people will notice: unless they try to run their favorite Android apps - starting from the Google ones - and they discover that they're not there...

Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#46

Post by threeseed »

nwh wrote: post #38
emanuer wrote: post #7

The Samsung software I have seen on their TVs, laptops, phones has been adequate at best. I wish them best of luck developing another closed ecosystem. However their track record of developing good, functioning software is not very promising. When you use Apple products everything is tied into Apple. I didn't like some parts of their ecosystem (Itunes). It is all or nothing for Apple, so I said farewell and moved on.…

> The Samsung software I have seen on their TVs, laptops, phones has been adequate at best. You've clearly used a Samsung SmartTV then. The software is so slow, so clunky, so unreliable; it's a hair pulling exercise just waiting for the thing to load (1-2 minutes to bring up the dashboard). Its bad enough to justify hauling the thing back to the shop and getting a refund.

I have a SmartTV as well. Tried the apps once and never touched it again. It really is 90's era software.

I honestly can't fathom why the TV manufacturers are just sitting back, twiddling their thumbs and waiting for Apple to come in and make them look stupid. I mean really is a TV so much more complicated to build a decent UI for than a smartphone or computer ?

Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#47

Post by AlexDanger »

chrisrhoden wrote: post #37
notatoad wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their other option is to declare android essentially a lost cause, let the device manufacturers do whatever they want to it, and develop their own "pure google" platform that runs on top of android and works around any OEM specific customizations. Coincidentally, they already have a platform that they maintain complete control over and that runs on top of other operating systems - Chrome. and android just got brought…

They have that now, but they don't because consumers do not care. The Nexus line is the best smartphone bargain that has ever happened, period, and it's still outsold by the Galaxy S III. They even use the words "pure google" in some of their marketing materials for the devices. Developers seem to be most of their market, though. They could also opt not to include the Google properties on such phones (GMail, Google P…

>The Nexus line is the best smartphone bargain that has ever happened, period, and it's still outsold by the Galaxy S III.

Dont forget what happened with the Nexus 4. A pure-android device with great hardware at a reasonable price. It sold out within an hour. Availability was terrible for weeks (months?) after launch. A very large number of people who wanted the phone couldnt have it and presumably went with other handsets such as the S3.

So clearly consumers do care, but in this case it was Google/LG who screwed up. I suspect they'll be better prepared for the next Nexus iteration.

Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#49

Post by mhaymo »

gonehome wrote: post #8

What's strange to me is that everything Samsung does to try and differentiate themselves just makes me like their phones less. Their hardware design is plastic and cheap feeling and I hate the touchwiz layer they put on top of android with their gimmicky features (camera based gesture controls? - who cares?). I think Apple, Nokia and even HTC make much nicer hardware (although HTC still puts its Sense on top of andro…

I think this is overstated. I switched from a Galaxy S3 to a Nexus 4 recently, and there are several ways in which I find the Nexus to be inferior.

Hardware:

- The Galaxy S3 is noticeable thinner and easier to hold.

- The hardware buttons lead to a more efficient use of space. The GS3 effectively has a larger screen, although the Nexus is roughly the same size as it has an empty, useless space where the S3's buttons are.

- I've never really felt/cared that plastic "looks cheap". It is highly light and durable, and doesn't slide in the hand and on surfaces like the glass Nexus.

Software:

- Samsung's settings toggle notification widget is very convenient, easier to use and with more options than the vanilla equivalent.

- Notifications are clearly separated into sticky and clearable sections, and clearable ones are chronologically ordered. I haven't yet figured out how stock Android organises its notifications, but so far it's been confusing.

- The camera app has several useful features like rapid-fire shooting.

Yes Samsung throws a lot of features at the wall, but they're largely inconsequential, and some of their changes are legitimate improvements.

Re: Samsung is hurting Android

#50

Post by threeseed »

mcintyre1994 wrote: post #6
raganwald wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fighting Google is the lesser of several evils. There are three companies doing serious mobile business: Apple, Amazon, and Samsung. All of them are at war with Google one way or another. Everyone playing "nice" with Google is losing money and/or insignificant. They're going down the same road that the PC vendors went down playing by Microsoft's rules. It looked like a different game at the outset because Google wasn…

This might sound crazy, but it seems that Google are trying to do the same to Apple as well. Obviously they won't switch to Android, but most consumers don't really care about the OS. Nobody can replace Google's apps - Apple can't, Samsung will fail if/when they try. By placing their apps on iOS, and essentially being the best of breed in every category, the long game seems to be to relegate Apple into the realm of t…

Have you never used the Google apps on the iOS before ?

They are good but not significantly better than Apple's built in ones. Apple Maps may have less quality data but has a much better UI and uses a lot less data. Google Now is pointless compared to the genuinely useful Android version. Chrome is slower in most cases than Safari and not integrated with the rest of the OS. And really all their other apps simply aren't popular.

Unfortunately Apple just doesn't give third party apps any room to expand beyond its tiny little sandbox.

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