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The Founder Visa

paulgraham.com

41–50 of 160 posts

Re: The Founder Visa

#41
I usually avoid politics, but since we now seem to have an administration that's open to suggestions, I'm going to risk making one

If your goal is to persuade as many people as possible, insulting the previous administration and by extension those that voted for Bush is a bad start. I was already opposed to your idea before the second sentence, despite the fact that I'm an advocate of increased legal immigration.

Re: The Founder Visa

#44

Having been through the hoops, I'd generally support this, but it's a tough sell in today's economy. Because there are emotions involved. There are already similar visas (EB-5 and E-1). Especially the E-1 category is very close and could easily be amended to fit Paul's ideas (I used the E-1 as co-founder of my previous startup, EVE). One issue that needs to be addressed: you are not likely to get funding until you mo…

It is bad that E1 is only available for certain countries. My country is not in the list.

Is there any other options?

Re: The Founder Visa

#45
The tricky part might seem to be how one defined a startup. But that could be solved quite easily: let the market decide.

As much as I support your position (I'm an open immigration advocate), the concept of "Let the market decide" isn't exactly a position I hear the government ever clamoring to support. The government wants control, and giving up control is it's antithesis.

Re: The Founder Visa

#46
As a non-American who applied to YC twice the article was a pleasant surprise. However I'm not sure America is as attractive to non-American founders as some people think. I'll explain (my arguments are mostly personal perceptions...I have no practical evidence yet on any of this since my own startup is still at the "wrote some code" stage).

Let's suppose there are 2 types of founders: people who have enough money & connections, and the young "live on Ramen noodles" type founders.

For the "money & connections" type, a lot of foreign countries offer cheap but still qualified programmers and don't put too many obstacles on founding companies so if your country is like that it might make sense to stay. For the "Ramen" type, many of them may not afford America's often high living costs.

As for the argument that the US provides a better/more free market... even this is changing: The internet probably allows relatively easy selling to worldwide customers from any country.

All that said, the American dream probably still lives on and many people would likely provide counter-examples to my limited point of view. Of course pg didn't claim that coming to the US is a no-brainer for every single talented hacker. There are probably enough of those who are interested to satisfy the 10,000 founder/year goal.

Re: The Founder Visa

#47
How would the government decide who's a startup investor? The same way they decide what counts as a university for student visas. We'll establish our own accreditation procedure.

This part scares me. Accreditation boards are a bug, not a feature. Perhaps, like pg's idea, they started out as well intentioned. But today, their primary purpose is to erect arbitrary barriers of entries, thus propping of the salaries of professionals and the tuition of the schools. The tech industry is great because it is so isolated from politics and bureaucracy. I'd hate for that to change.

Re: The Founder Visa

#48
This idea is a special case of Gary Becker's proposal to sell the right to immigrate (http://www.becker-posner-blog.com/archives/2005/02/sell_the_...). In this special case, the investors in the immigrant's business would pay the immigration fee.

I don't see why the potential benefit to the US of immigrants with startup ideas is necessarily greater than immigrants of similar technical skills with no stated intention to start a company. But the immigration fee could help in sorting that out.

Re: The Founder Visa

#49
post #41

I usually avoid politics, but since we now seem to have an administration that's open to suggestions, I'm going to risk making one If your goal is to persuade as many people as possible, insulting the previous administration and by extension those that voted for Bush is a bad start. I was already opposed to your idea before the second sentence, despite the fact that I'm an advocate of increased legal immigration.

I thought the risk was in opening the floodgates of pure political discussion on HN.

Re: The Founder Visa

#50
post #38

Having been through the hoops, I'd generally support this, but it's a tough sell in today's economy. Because there are emotions involved. There are already similar visas (EB-5 and E-1). Especially the E-1 category is very close and could easily be amended to fit Paul's ideas (I used the E-1 as co-founder of my previous startup, EVE). One issue that needs to be addressed: you are not likely to get funding until you mo…

> you are not likely to get funding until you move here I think it's likely that if this visa existed, VCs would adapt to it by becoming more open to funding people who haven't immigrated yet.

VC's barely (meaning, almost not at all) adapt to citizens who haven't yet moved to Boston or San Jose yet.
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