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Why Lift is My Favorite Web Framework

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Re: Why Lift is My Favorite Web Framework

#41

Post by shadowfiend »

coldtea wrote: post #29
riveramj wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

dpp did not leave lift. true he has other projects and focuses on more than just lift, but he is still heavily involved in it. as to why typesafe chose play over lift: they wanted to go with lift but dpp didn't want to work with them - didnt think it a wise decision. his explanation: http://www.quora.com/Lift-web-framework/Why-did-Typesafe-sel...

> dpp did not leave lift. true he has other projects and focuses on more than just lift, but he is still heavily involved in it. Well, this doesn't sound a lot better than him leaving the project.

With a team of committers that are contributing consistently to the project, as well as David continuing to contribute regularly, I have no idea how you can get by saying this. Releases have continued apace, and work on Lift 3 has begun. What exactly is it that you think would be bad were dpp to leave the project altogether that you see happening right now?

Re: Why Lift is My Favorite Web Framework

#42

Post by shadowfiend »

muglug wrote: post #30

Lift's JS & jQuery code generation is nightmare-inducing, it's ridiculous to call it a "benefit". JavaScript should not be auto-generated by some flavour-of-the-week web framework in a totally different language. You're just creating a whole world of pain for future-you.

I think calling it nightmare-inducing is going too far, but there's nothing that forces you to use it. I think it's fantastic for prototyping, because it lets you focus on getting things done in one place. If you're not prototyping, I think you should keep your JS in JS and come up with a common interface to interact with your JS from the server—I've chosen events dispatched on the document element in a variety of situations as that communication protocol.

Re: Why Lift is My Favorite Web Framework

#43

Post by yogsototh »

microtonal wrote: post #35
tikhonj wrote: post #13

Many of the same advantages (and some additional ones, no doubt) hold for the Haskell web frameworks, with the added benefit of using Haskell. I'm in no position to say whether Yesod or Lift is better; I just wish more people would consider Haskell at all--it's a great choice for web programming (among many other things).

Yesod is great, especially its quasi quoters, such as Hamlet. However, two things that I constantly bumped into maintaining a small Yesod app is that there was a fairly constant stream of API changes and that deployment on different machines was annoying because of version conflicts installing packages. If you use Yesod, you are probably best off using a Cabal sandbox (e.g. via cabal-dev) and making specific package…

Concerning the cabal dependencies problem. I didn't tested it yet, but I believe a sane solution should be to use stackage[1].

I know fpcomplete use stackage for their School of Haskell[2]. This way, there is never any package dependency problem. Which gives them the incredible ability to execute yesod application directly on their server from the code of an user changing the code in the browser. If you haven't did it yet, you should really try it.

Also, concerning the deployment, having a single statically linked binary is very similar to having a single jar file. And this is very easy to deploy using heroku for example.

You can ask me more detail if you want to know how I deploy my application but this is mostly very well documented in the wiki.

[1]: https://github.com/fpco/stackage [2]: https://www.fpcomplete.com/school

Re: Why Lift is My Favorite Web Framework

#44

Post by microtonal »

tikhonj wrote: post #36
microtonal wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesod is great, especially its quasi quoters, such as Hamlet. However, two things that I constantly bumped into maintaining a small Yesod app is that there was a fairly constant stream of API changes and that deployment on different machines was annoying because of version conflicts installing packages. If you use Yesod, you are probably best off using a Cabal sandbox (e.g. via cabal-dev) and making specific package…

Well, for very relative values of "all-functional". But yeah, Cabal is certainly a bit of a pain. Happily, people are working on it. Superior cabal-dev functionality is going to be integrated into cabal proper very soon, if it hasn't already, for example. Also, couldn't you just compile your binary with static linking and just deploy that? I understand there can be problems if you depend on certain non-Haskell librar…

Not everyone develops on the same platform as an application is deployed.

Re: Why Lift is My Favorite Web Framework

#45

Post by wingchen »

dkhenry wrote: post #38

I am amazed people even see Lift as in the same balpark as Play. When I last used lift It appeared to be a relic of the J2EE stack ported to a new language. This goes beyond any technical capabilities of the framework and down to how it expects you to work in it. Even the author says that just getting started can be a pain, doesn't that tell you something about your framework. It its hard to understand what to do its…

Well, we cannot assume that people cannot learn. Snippets are smaller piece of codes compared to controllers, and logically making more sense. All you have to do is to train people. Isn't it the way people learn MVC too?

Re: Why Lift is My Favorite Web Framework

#46

Post by wingchen »

neya wrote: post #37

I might get downvoted for this..but I'll risk it, because it is a message that needs to be passed. My experience on using Lift. A few months ago, I was evaluating various frameworks to start off with my new web app. I am already running a dozen RoR apps and gradually I'm moving away from RoR. I will explain as to why, later in my post. I was evaluating between Play and Lift and I ended up choosing....Lift. Lift has a…

Awesome response.
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