Earlier quoted context omitted.
Same thing happened to me, only it was in Armenia and grown-up Armenians were talking sh*t to me for being a half-Russian kid (think 1st-grade age). I wouldn't say "Russians are discriminatory", just "people from the former USSR are usually discriminatory". From my experience, in both countries, Armenia was a lot worse.
The same thing happened to me, except I'm 100% Armenian, but my native language happens to be Russian, because it was the primarily spoken language in our family. It's just xenophobia.
Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
41–50 of 135 posts
Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#42Forgive me: This is both a comment on the content and in the process I mentioned something I made recently. I don't want any more users right now. I have a bucket for links called "Mythbusting" on this service I made named Scrooty. I called the bucket "Mythbusting" not as a reference to the TV show but rather for a particular category of content. I often run into misconceptions and tropes that bother me. One of those…
You might want to add Shin Dong-hyuk's first-hand account of life in a North Korean prison camp. Slavery, starvation, torture, rape, and murder are the norm, and given that it's illegal to be related to someone in prison, a ridiculous percentage of the country's population is enslaved in these prisons. The DPRK's human rights violations go well beyond the oft-cited starvation of the populace. http://www.cbsnews.com/8…
Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#43Forgive me: This is both a comment on the content and in the process I mentioned something I made recently. I don't want any more users right now. I have a bucket for links called "Mythbusting" on this service I made named Scrooty. I called the bucket "Mythbusting" not as a reference to the TV show but rather for a particular category of content. I often run into misconceptions and tropes that bother me. One of those…
Entering the university was not the biggest problem for Jews in USSR. And what scares me is that people, like the director of admissions, who actually discriminated the Jews usually did not hate them. They discriminated because they were told to do so.
Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#44What's interesting is that according to several narratives from those close to the central committee under Stalin, anti-semitic policies in the Soviet Union started from geo-political maneuvering rather than any inherent personal sense of racism. Sudoplatov, an NKVD agent who worked for Beria, wrote in his memoirs that the original Soviet post-war plans were actually to establish a Jewish republic in the Crimea , wit…
On that note: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Autonomous_Oblast
"The establishment of the Jewish Autonomous Oblast in Birobidzhan in 1928 was ordered by Stalin only as an effort to strengthen the Far Eastern border region with an outpost, not as a favor to the Jews. The area was constantly penetrated by Chinese and White Russian terrorist groups, and the idea was to shield the territory by establishing a settlement whose inhabitants would be hostile to White Russian emigres, especially the Cossacks. The status of the region was defined shrewdly as an autonomous district, not as an autonomous republic, which meant that no local legislature, high court, or government post of ministerial rank was permitted. It was an autonomous area, but a bare frontier, not a political center."
Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#45Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#46Earlier quoted context omitted.
>This is a link I'm saving for the next time somebody tries to tell me how devoid of racism the Soviet Union was. We have a similar quota system in America that limits asian admissions and with talks of extending quotas to limit male admissions in STEM degrees. What's not clear is if these Jewish quotas were proportional to population or not.
Author here. As far as I understand, the Jewish quotas were not proportional to the population. The other significant difference is that all these policies were completely opaque, not like you can find out how much Jews the university can accept this year. Officially, no such policy existed, but everyone knew it did. In my dad's case, he was told he failed the health exam, which was a complete lie. There were many ot…
Note that she wasn't denied admission: this happened mid-flight. This is very different from being turned down at one university, choosing to attend another university, and from that point being judged solely on academics. Another example is Moscow State University having a computer program that looked for Jewish sounding student last names and automatically lowered their grades.
Anti-Semitism/Anti-Judaism in Tzarist Russia was incredibly harsh (see the etymology of the word "pogrom"), but it was codified and known: one knew what the Jewish quotas were at the universities and the entire nascent capitalist sphere was open to Jews (e.g., a Jew could become a "merchant of first guild"). Being baptized was also the way out for some (e.g., Anton Rubinstein) as Jewish identity was considered a religion as opposed to an ethnicity.
Again, I don't mean to white-wash the harsh and destructive anti-Semitism of the Tzars -- indeed, it contained many seeds (Protocols of Elders of Zion, conflation of Judaism with both Marxism and Capitalism, etc...) for the racist anti-Semitism of Nazis and Soviets, but there's something to be said for at least an official acknowledgement that the system existed as opposed and being able to work around it.
Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#47Thanks for posting. I just sent this to my parents who were also in the Soviet Union until we all emigrated to the US. Here's the response from my mom: Yes, it's typical. The only thing which surprises me that the dad's dad insisted on military in 1970 - there was an antisemitic campaign in military in 1961 and grandfather could not miss it. Usually families knew which colleges accept Jewish kids, which did not and u…
My close friend's mother could not believe it until her son, a straight-A student from K to 12, was given a failing grade at an entrance exam in physics which he knew and understood very well. Oh, it's funny to remember now, by the way. They would give him a problem, then come back before he would finish the solution, say "you did not solve it" and mark it with a minus. Several times he was faster than them. Still, after a while they got a sufficient number of minuses and said good-bye to him. He expected it would be a losing battle, but still was a little shocked at their arrogance.
Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#48Earlier quoted context omitted.
>This is a link I'm saving for the next time somebody tries to tell me how devoid of racism the Soviet Union was. We have a similar quota system in America that limits asian admissions and with talks of extending quotas to limit male admissions in STEM degrees. What's not clear is if these Jewish quotas were proportional to population or not.
Author here. As far as I understand, the Jewish quotas were not proportional to the population. The other significant difference is that all these policies were completely opaque, not like you can find out how much Jews the university can accept this year. Officially, no such policy existed, but everyone knew it did. In my dad's case, he was told he failed the health exam, which was a complete lie. There were many ot…
After WWII my grandfather wanted nothing to do with his Jewish heritage. He bribed officials for new papers that changed the families last name and official ethnicity.
There is no doubt in my mind of the discrimination Jews faced in the Soviet bloc. On the other hand, I think it's a little more nuanced. Jews often occupied important positions in the system and were entitled to privileges that came along with said positions.
Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#49Earlier quoted context omitted.
>This is a link I'm saving for the next time somebody tries to tell me how devoid of racism the Soviet Union was. We have a similar quota system in America that limits asian admissions and with talks of extending quotas to limit male admissions in STEM degrees. What's not clear is if these Jewish quotas were proportional to population or not.
It the quotas were proportional there would have been way smaller number of Soviet Jews with university diplomas. Jews were disproportionally represented in universities in USSR even with all the quotas. Similar quotas also existed for Russians and other non-locals in national republics - e.g. it was much harder for a Russian to be admitted to the university in Uzbek SSR compared to an Uzbek. This was a bit more nuan…
Soviets had a quite complex migration policy, including moving people around "by order" (both forced mass movements of nationalities and also job location assignments that could move you 2000km away), and also 'carrot/stick' with having opposite policies in various parts of USSR to achieve whatever people/nationality migrations and grand social engineering plans they had.
Re: Soviet College Admission — My Dad's Story (1970)
#501) Most colleges admit large numbers of students who are officially reported as "race/ethnicity unknown."
2) The definition of "race" categories in current United States regulations is arbitrary, acknowledged by the Census Bureau to be unscientific, does not match categories used in any other country, and has changed several times in my lifetime.
3) "Jewish" has never been an officially regarded category in the United States for tracking data on the issue of college admission, but Jews once faced considerable barriers getting into many colleges.
4) The subset of United States high school students who are college-ready by what courses they have completed during high school has a much different "race" composition from the general United States population.
Several of the replies in this interesting thread ask questions about the system in the United States, so I will refer here to the definitive FAQ about "race" in United States college admission,
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/13664...
so that those of you who like to look up reliable sources and check facts are able to do that about this contentious issue. The FAQ will have to be revised, of course, after the Supreme Court issues its opinion in a pending case (cited in the FAQ). Full references to the facts listed above can be found in the FAQ.
The collection of "Jewish Problems" (very tough mathematics problems reputedly given to Jewish applicants to Soviet universities) by Tanya Khovanova and Alexey Radul on arXiv
http://arxiv.org/abs/1110.1556
is directly on-topic for the main submission here. How many of those problems could you solve to get into university?