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The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

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Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#41

Post by Wingman4l7 »

I find it completely ridiculous -- how on Earth could a the ACS hope to apply any sort of standard evaluation to a CS / IT degree earned in any of a dozen countries, from any of a thousand universities (with attendant varying degree requirements and relative differences in course difficulty), not to mention evaluating self-taught skills or industry experience in hundreds of specialties. A programmer is not a tradesman.

No IT employer in Australia that I've communicated with has ever mentioned the ACS in regards to qualifications, not once -- I would be surprised if any even know it exists, unless they have worked with sponsoring skilled worker visas.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#43

Post by retrogradeorbit »

tomcorrigan wrote: post #30
retrogradeorbit wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

10.2% (2011 census data) of Australian properties are sitting there vacant. [ http://blog.id.com.au/2012/australian-census-2011/the-where-... ] And there is certainly urban decay all over the city I live in (Perth). Also, building codes are local government, aren't they? So it depends on what council you are in. And I've certainly heard some bad stories.

From the linked article: > While dwellings are vacant for a number of reasons they are primarily associated with holiday areas

Seems inner city Sydney is a 'holiday area'.

[ http://australianpropertyforum.com/blog/main/3204321 ]

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#44

Post by daemin »

jacques_chester wrote: post #37
daemin wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did one of these a few years ago and it seemed like quite a formality, they asked vague questions about topics related to professionalism rather than any technical skill. While I can understand that a professional body would want to ensure that people acted ethically and in good faith, I would think that it would be wiser to ensure that people graduating from technical, engineering related, and detail oriented degr…

The reason they hammer on the Code of Ethics is because that's what other professions have. They need to show that there's some Code that could be made enforceable by legislation. It's part of the bigger plan to lever the ACS into the same role that the law societies or the AMA enjoy.

As far as software is concerned, until we have proper liability for defective software, ala Civil/Mechanical Engineering (where one signs their name to the design to certify safety and fit-for-purpose), we have little right to call ourselves (Software) Engineers, and hence no real reason for a professional accreditation/certification body.

I also just looked at the website, and all of the membership levels look like rankings in a guild system to me. Spend your time, pay more money, rise in ranks. Protectionism at its finest, and even though I'm heavily a software developer, I'm still against this burden.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#45

Post by throwaway2048 »

jpatokal wrote: post #34
retrogradeorbit wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

10.2% (2011 census data) of Australian properties are sitting there vacant. [ http://blog.id.com.au/2012/australian-census-2011/the-where-... ] And there is certainly urban decay all over the city I live in (Perth). Also, building codes are local government, aren't they? So it depends on what council you are in. And I've certainly heard some bad stories.

As your link itself explains, the vast majority of those vacant properties are either a) holiday homes that are empty outside vacation season, or b) "areas with declining population where dwellings are simply abandoned by owners who can’t sell their property". Vacancy rates in major cities are remarkably low.

it may not be a big problem at present, as there is a huge real estate boom in Australia. But when there is an economic downturn these regulations are going to hit older areas extremely hard, just like they have in many other nations.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#46

Post by beamso »

verelo wrote: post #40

I'd love to hear Matt's views on TAFE, i think accreditation has a very important place in our society (mainly because i got very sick of uneducated morons charging people for fixing computers, writing bad code...etc) Anyway, the fact that Matt is complaining about fees and then is happy to be associated with the Singularity University that chargs $25k for a course ( http://apply2013.singularityu.org/res/p/faq/ ) mak…

I believe Matt is strongly pro accreditation.

http://www.theage.com.au/it-pro/business-it/fierce-debate-is...

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#47

Post by beamso »

jacques_chester wrote: post #12

I basically joined the ACS because it's there and I figured I ought to. They gave me a post-nominal: CT. If I want the next grade up -- CP -- I will need to take thousands of dollars of synergising-outside-the-box courses. Basically the ACS isn't really for software engineers. It's for middle management. I won't be renewing. (I might renew my ACM/IEEE memberships).

I never joined. The ACS was not referred to in a positive manner when I was at university.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#48

Post by drakeandrews »

jacques_chester wrote: post #15

I think I can explain the Electrical Engineering thing. A few years ago the ACS geared up to join some sort of peak body for professions. They took the view that they should represent all software professionals of any kind. Then Engineers Australia put in a competing claim for jurisdiction over software engineers. The scoundrels . I remember this because I was a student member at the time (hey, free BBQs) and they se…

Completely irrelevant, but I must say I like the phrase "everybody is pissing on everyone's curtains".

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#49

Post by damian2000 »

tnuc wrote: post #42

If you don't like the Australian Computer Society accreditation, you could could always become a Microsoft Certified Professional. Which one is the bigger joke?

Totally different. MCSD and the like are actually ok for training in very specific areas of study, assuming you don't cheat of course.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#50

Post by femto »

mctx wrote: post #29
throwaway2048 wrote: post #6

Accreditation is common in many industries in Australia, it's basically a huge racket. To legally do any wiring work at all it must be done by an accredited electrician, not merely inspected by one as in most countries. in fact most home improvements of any kind must be performed by an accredited tradesman. add to this the laws that state any home improvement must bring the entire house up to current building codes,…

> To legally do any wiring work at all it must be done by an accredited electrician, not merely inspected by one as in most countries. And contract electricians cost upwards of $80/hour, making replacing a light fitting prohibitively expensive.

Which is why many houses now have GPOs (power points) in the ceiling space, and the light fittings are appliances plugged into the GPO, rather than permanently installed. Domestically, it is legal to work on things that are not permanently wired in, the main constraint being that you should follow good practice, so you don't kill someone.

I'm surprised that a keen DIYer hasn't tried using a 3-phase 32A plug to plug their house into the mains, and claim the entire house is an appliance.

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