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Banksy works cost public almost £150k

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#41

Post by scott_w »

dgellow wrote: post #39

> The Ministry of Justice (MoJ) says it has spent £50,000 trying to remove paint from the wall of the Grade II-listed building in Carey Street. How in the world do you spend £50k to remove a graffiti?

It's a Grade II-listed building meaning you have to be very careful with it to restore it to its previous state. It's not enough to give it a good scrub, you've also got to ensure you minimise damage to the stonework. There'll also be required paperwork with the local authority to ensure the work they're doing is correct.

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#42

Post by woodruffw »

dgellow wrote: post #39

> The Ministry of Justice (MoJ) says it has spent £50,000 trying to remove paint from the wall of the Grade II-listed building in Carey Street. How in the world do you spend £50k to remove a graffiti?

From a very quick look online, “Grade II” means that the building is of historic or architectural interest. I think it’s reasonable to infer that cleaning graffiti off of a building like that might require materials or consultations that a normal removal wouldn’t, although I have no idea whether £50K is a reasonable amount for that. I guess it would depend on the material, size of the graffiti, etc.

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#43

Post by tptacek »

ForOldHack wrote: post #35
ryandrake wrote: post #17

The article's photo of the art barricaded from public view with two security people standing guard in front of it speaks even louder than the original artwork. And then, further down in the article, the picture of a whole structure built to block the view of the piece, with a locked door. Satire writing itself!

Oh the irony. Oh my.

You almost have to ask if Sotheby's didn't somehow arrange for it.

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#44

Post by ryandrake »

ForOldHack wrote: post #38
bonoboTP wrote: post #34

Why does it take 85k to remove it from the wall? I'm pretty sure it doesn't cost that much. There is some ridiculous government inefficiency or embezzling happening or some kind of learned helplessness or malicious compliance. Just go, wash it off and done.

Rediculous government ineffiency is multiple redundancies. Just government. They could replace it with another commissioned Banksy for half of that.

$84,500 in the pockets of the government's favorite contracting companies.

$500 to the guy who pressure washes it off the side of the building

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#45

Post by BoingBoomTschak »

jccalhoun wrote: post #10

Shadow Justice Secretary Nick Timothy said: ""Our courts are a national symbol of justice and the rule of law." It seems like someone doesn't get the symbolism of the Banksy piece.

How could you not get the "symbolism" of Banksy? The man is as subtle as a Family Guy episode.

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#46

Post by scott_w »

For the comments questioning why the MoJ are doing this, and the reason for the costs, the information can be found in the article:

> A HM Courts and Tribunals Service (HMCTS) spokesperson said: "The Royal Courts of Justice is a listed building and HMCTS are obliged to maintain its original character."

This is the why. HMCTS don't have the option to "just leave it" because they're obligated by legislation to remove the graffiti. Discussions about whether it'll bring in tourism are irrelevant to the discussion. The law requires the listed building to be maintained in its original state, so the government department follows the law.

As for the costs:

> Court staff barricaded off the area and guarded it. Attempts to clean off the mural began immediately.

> Westminster City Council will have to inspect the wall and if the removal is deemed incomplete, another cleaning method will have to be used.

> As a final option, the affected stonework may have to be removed and replaced.

> A Listed Building Consent (LBC) application has been submitted for the installation of railings across the wall that Banksy targeted.

All of this costs money, it's not just a case of putting a bit of turps on the wall and job done. It'll require experts to remove it without causing further damage.

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#47

Post by tptacek »

ryandrake wrote: post #44
ForOldHack wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rediculous government ineffiency is multiple redundancies. Just government. They could replace it with another commissioned Banksy for half of that.

$84,500 in the pockets of the government's favorite contracting companies. $500 to the guy who pressure washes it off the side of the building

The article discusses this. They attempted to wash it off the building and failed.

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#48

Post by bArray »

Banksy is an establishment-approved protestor, they promote him regularly [1]. His artwork is regularly on display in galleries [2]. They could easily seize the works to pay for costs, but don't. His name is supposedly Robin Gunningham from Bristol [3], they could take him to court. The whole thing is ridiculous.

[1] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/topics/cp7r8vglgj1t

[2] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz91zpgn43do

[3] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c98q8llqq4po

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#49

Post by tptacek »

dgellow wrote: post #40
artisinal wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn’t an American building where you buy a couple of two-by-fours and some plastic siding from Home Depot. It’s a historical building made out of stone.

You think a stone building is hard to clean with a Kärcher?

Not without damaging the masonry. It wouldn't matter at all if it were a standard municipal building, but this building is protected. If Banksy stenciled another My Chemical Romance poster on the Frank Lloyd Wright Unity Temple in Oak Park, you'd get a flavor for how complicated the discussion would be.

Re: Banksy works cost public almost £150k

#50

Post by scott_w »

Schiendelman wrote: post #26
tptacek wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can't. It's a listed building. They're legally obligated to remove it.

Absolutely not. There is no enforcement mechanism to punish them if they chose not to enforce the listed building rules.

Just to be clear, you're asking the Ministry of Justice, the department responsible for maintaining the court system, to break the law? I can't think how that could have horrendous long-term consequences...
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