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Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

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Re: Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

#41

Post by abirch »

Eddy_Viscosity2 wrote: post #39
vvpan wrote: post #20

Real World Assets (RWA) is the hot stuff these days. While it is still early the mega-banks are starting to pile on. One of the reasons is that any infrastructure built on blockchain is reusable for free by everybody (minus transaction free). Uniswap and Aave have been chugging along for years and are starting to acquire reputation beyond retail. Privacy is moving along as well where you can tokenize, say, bonds and…

Free (minus transaction fee) could be used to describe traditional banking and a lot of other services as well. What will happen if/when this (or any) approach gets really popular is some group will figure out how to control the fee and start ratcheting it up in classic rent-seeking style. Capitalism always finds a way to monopoly.

Or there will be wholesale fraud similar to how index funds have been hijacked by companies with crazy valuations.

Re: Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

#42

Post by kimjune01 »

tamimio wrote: post #9
WalterBright wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like you're suggesting a barter economy. It works like this: 1. Bob grows oranges, and wants shoes 2. Ted hunts for meat, and wants oranges 3. Sam makes shoes, and wants meat The only way this can work is to have a 3-way transaction. But with a money system, the money is traded without needing a 3-way transaction. It's much more efficient.

Not really, I am not saying to remove moneys entirely and use assets trading only, but the money printed or valued should be based on tangible assets, actual cost, not some made up speculation. As I mentioned above, a house that cost 100k to build and handover should never exceed that value plus profit markup, the older it gets, the cheaper it should be, just like any other assets and like how japan did it to solve t…

end the fed?

Re: Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

#43

Post by daedrdev »

mschuster91 wrote: post #17
daedrdev wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is because our glorious government makes it illegal to build housing. Japan doesnt force anything, their private companies built tons of housing because there is profit to be made and its not illegal without years of reviews, insane taxes, bribes to various orgs, etc. Your policy doesn’t even work in CA, new housing is absurdly expensive to build and the profits aren't even high.

> Japan doesnt force anything, their private companies built tons of housing because there is profit to be made and its not illegal without years of reviews, insane taxes, bribes to various orgs, etc. Now, would you want to live in a country with conditions so absurd that "hikikomori" and micro apartments [1] are a thing? > “A lot of younger people these days don’t have many possessions, unlike older generations – th…

Japan’s work life balance, and their housing regulations are only slightly related and I’d say almost completely unrelated

Re: Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

#44

Post by WalterBright »

mmooss wrote: post #35
WalterBright wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> money printed or valued should be based on tangible assets The US had such a system before 1914. Money was exchangeable for gold at a fixed rate. That system was destroyed in 1914 with the Federal Reserve Act, and the inevitable result was endless inflation and debasing of the currency. The once common compliment "sound as a dollar" has vanished from the lexicon.

The USD is considered the most sound currency in the world and has been for generations; maybe it's the most sound in the history of humanity (possibly a consequence of modern international relations and communications). The great majority of international transactions are in USD. At small shops in a lot out of the way places, they accept USD; many prefer it to their local currency.

It would be a lot sounder if it wasn't inflated away by deficit spending.

"Most sound" is relative. The other countries are simply worse at inflating the money supply.

Re: Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

#45

Post by mschuster91 »

daedrdev wrote: post #43
mschuster91 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Japan doesnt force anything, their private companies built tons of housing because there is profit to be made and its not illegal without years of reviews, insane taxes, bribes to various orgs, etc. Now, would you want to live in a country with conditions so absurd that "hikikomori" and micro apartments [1] are a thing? > “A lot of younger people these days don’t have many possessions, unlike older generations – th…

Japan’s work life balance, and their housing regulations are only slightly related and I’d say almost completely unrelated

> and I’d say almost completely unrelated

To the contrary, IMHO. When you have to stay at the office until the boss leaves... you don't need a large apartment, you won't have much free time to enjoy it anyway.

The excessive amount of both fake and real work makes such horribly insane housing practices possible in the first place - if people had more free time, they'd go nuts from being cooped up.

Re: Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

#46

Post by mschuster91 »

infecto wrote: post #24
mschuster91 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Japan doesnt force anything, their private companies built tons of housing because there is profit to be made and its not illegal without years of reviews, insane taxes, bribes to various orgs, etc. Now, would you want to live in a country with conditions so absurd that "hikikomori" and micro apartments [1] are a thing? > “A lot of younger people these days don’t have many possessions, unlike older generations – th…

Why use suicidal hyperbole. It’s low class along with the language. I don’t know if what you stated is enough evidence to prove much of anything either. Just because building housing is cheap and quick in Japan does not mean it needs to be small.

> Just because building housing is cheap and quick in Japan does not mean it needs to be small.

The thing is, cheap housing comes at a cost. Housing barely qualifying as more than "a roof over the head" is the most efficient use under capitalism... but as usual with capitalism, the second-order effects / externalities (most importantly, the collapsed birth rartes) aren't priced in. Unfortunately, for Japan's society it may already be too late to turn around.

And even more unfortunately, here in the Western countries we are headed to repeating the mistakes Japan has already shown.

Re: Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

#47

Post by reaperducer »

jt2190 wrote: post #29
Animats wrote: post #22

"It also includes built-in safeguards that allow the farmer to swap one dead cow for a live one." Is that backwards? If you own the token for a cow, and it dies, what happens?

There’s a credit agreement that will spell out those details: > To turn cattle into trusted financial guarantees or collateral without requiring inspectors to visit the property, Cowmed equips cows with an AI-powered Smarty Collar. These collars constantly monitor health, behavior, and location. The raw data is then converted into an encrypted digital identity tied directly to the B3 credit agreement . [Emphasis mine…

Cowmed equips cows with an AI-powered Smarty Collar. These collars constantly monitor health, behavior, and location.

They've had these for cows in America for years, and even for people in the hospital. Long before "A.I."

What makes these "smart," as compared to something like a bio button?

https://www.medtronic.com/en-us/healthcare-professionals/pro...

Re: Brazilian farmers tokenized dairy cows to get loans, bypassing bank limits

#50

Post by mmooss »

derefr wrote: post #33
mmooss wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Real World Assets (RWA) is the hot stuff these days. > Uniswap and Aave have been chugging along for years How hot? I haven't heard of it or them, but that's hardly strong evidence. What do you see? > One of the reasons is that any infrastructure built on blockchain is reusable for free by everybody Does that have an impact? I doubt consumers care about free. They certainly care about high levels of integrity (my m…

The "reusable for free" aspect is about building ecosystems. Abstractions that can be freely integrated with have low barriers to entry to existing complementary systems being updated to integrate with them, or with new systems evolving to wrap them or work in terms of them. This (plus the fact that blockchain smart contracts are generally limited in size) has the effect of commoditizing much of any given design, ins…

We mostly agree on your points. As I said, the FOSS aspects (which you describe well) are of interest to "undercapitalized startups, amateur financial services, and hackers interested in innovation in this area."

I think my additional points are essential, however: Consumers (and the public) are not interested in rapid development of financial instruments, they are interested in integrity and availability. To them, 'rapid' is a negative. And status quo powers in the financial industry, the banks, are not interested for other reasons too.

Maybe the best thing to develop is a way to make blockchain financial instruments have integrity and availability to match the existing financial system. The integrity and availability are awful, with a high frequency of scams, arguably enabled by the 'rapid' development aspects. If integrity and availability could be integrated into the abstractions, there might be a lot more interest.

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