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Remote Attestation

liamcvw.com

41–50 of 113 posts

Re: Remote Attestation

#41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> running the expected payload SGX does not cryptographically guarantee this. It cryptographically guarantees that the processor contains a legitimate provisioning key signed by Intel. Intel pinky promises that its processor will then only use this provisioning key in certain ways. This promise is essentially unauditable, and previous SGX bugs have shown that Intel isn't really in a position to make it anyway.

You are 100% correct, but this is still mostly fine: without SGX, you need to completely trust Signal, since it could trivially modify the server-side code. But with SGX, you only need to trust that Signal and Intel won't both collude. The most likely attacks on Signal involve trusted insiders or configuration errors, and SGX mostly prevents these, since to exploit it, you'd need to bribe insiders in both Signal and…

> The most likely attacks on Signal involve trusted insiders or configuration errors, and SGX mostly prevents these, since to exploit it, you'd need to bribe insiders in both Signal and Intel, or find configuration errors in both of their software stacks.

Since there have been multiple SGX key extraction vulnerabilities already, all you would have to do is compromise Signal and then use the key extracted from any of those devices, and "compromise Signal" is the same thing you would have to do if they weren't using SGX at all.

Re: Remote Attestation

#42
post #19

It's a nice idea, but I wouldn't design any system on the assumption that a TPM needs to stay secure for the system to be safe. There's been so many exploits. We can consider the iphone as an R & D platform for doing blackbox computations. In that nothing is allowed to run that Apple doesn't want. Protecting that is apples bread and butter and they care about it enough to value critical exploits in the millions. Yet…

By that metric we should just pack it all up and call it a day on computing in general; because even despite literal trillions of dollars being spent on it, we still haven't found a way to make it secure.

Not all computing that is useful must also be absolutely secure. Maybe we just have overextended the use of computers into areas where using them generates too much risk? If so, where is the boundary?

Re: Remote Attestation

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Attestation is a critical security property for these environments. No it's not. Every corporate network to which I've connected worked just fine without it.

[flagged]

> Do you debate vaccines with your doctors too?

If by "debate", you mean I take their advice into consideration and then make my own decision without blindly trusting them, then yes I do.

Re: Remote Attestation

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Attestation is a critical security property for these environments. No it's not. Every corporate network to which I've connected worked just fine without it.

[flagged]

> (Make claim that something is "critical".)

> (Get challenged on that.)

> omg you don't know anything, being without the thing is primitive and everyone sophisticated uses it.

You can see how you can be accused of not actually presenting any arguments here, right? If you're gonna appeal to authority, at least back that appeal up with something.

Re: Remote Attestation

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Do you debate vaccines with your doctors too? If by "debate", you mean I take their advice into consideration and then make my own decision without blindly trusting them, then yes I do.

I hope you put a lot more research into those debates than you did with this topic! I just don't understand why you'd have this overconfident hot take about a topic you clearly aren't familiar with. Like, try to understand the article subject and audience first?

Re: Remote Attestation

#46
post #2

It would be a nice addition if big tech didn't abuse this to shove user-hostile software into devices which the user has paid for (like smartphones).. thanks to this attitude, whenever I see "remote attestation" I associate this with "hostile".. > Using a TPM, we can remotely, cryptographically prove a couple of things: Unless there are exploits..

> whenever I see "remote attestation" I associate this with "hostile" HN is bizarre. This is just standard infrastructure security practice at any tech company of meaningful size. You are misunderstanding the target use case and audience of this article.

It is true that it is pretty common in large companies. It is also true that it feels very hostile to some people (myself included).

Re: Remote Attestation

#47
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> whenever I see "remote attestation" I associate this with "hostile" HN is bizarre. This is just standard infrastructure security practice at any tech company of meaningful size. You are misunderstanding the target use case and audience of this article.

It is true that it is pretty common in large companies. It is also true that it feels very hostile to some people (myself included).

The audience of this article are people working with infrastructure, not people developing user facing products. See quote: "If your infra consistently enforces mTLS ..."

Re: Remote Attestation

#48

This is the dream of corporate authoritarians everywhere. The dystopian nightmare we all warned about because we saw it coming. "Security" is the "think of the children" fearmongering of the current environment. As one of our Founding Fathers put it: "Those who give up freedom for security deserve neither." Remote Attestation: Just Say No.

Remote Attestation has valid use cases. I assume that you see problems with e.g. RA backed DRM or tamper protection on consumer devices like smartphones. In an ideal world, a political decision would have to be made about allowed use cases for RA that sets up limits where it conflicts with consumer protections. This isn't a technical problem.

Re: Remote Attestation

#49
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> (Make claim that something is "critical".) > (Get challenged on that.) > omg you don't know anything, being without the thing is primitive and everyone sophisticated uses it. You can see how you can be accused of not actually presenting any arguments here, right? If you're gonna appeal to authority, at least back that appeal up with something .

My comment is fine. Appeals to authority are not inherently bad when the person doesn't know what they're talking about. Again, your doctor is more of an authority than you on medicine. It'd be hubris to think you'd understand the field better, no matter how smart you are.

It's not my job to write an essay in the comments about why mutual authn with RA is desirable in corporate networks, and why the complaints about "freedom" are totally and utterly nonsensical in this context. This is something he can look up very quickly.

Re: Remote Attestation

#50
post #35
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, do you like ads? I assume you don't.. so how would you react if Apple followed Google and prohibited ad blocking apps + removed that capability from web browsers? I'd not be able to put up with that, but more importantly, I'd not want to be in the position where I can't even protest anything because there's no alternative to switch to..

When did google prohibit ad blocking in their browser?

https://9to5google.com/2026/06/15/google-chromes-next-update...
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