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HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

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Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#41

Post by arbol »

dang wrote: post #33
Bender wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see others also mentioned the voting ring detector. I think they're correct that something needs adjustment, but I don't know how it works exactly so it's hard to suggest thresholds. The patterns I am observing is that the LLM generated clones will get instantly upvoted multiple times I assume by other warmed up LLM accounts . Back in the days of running phpBB I would mitigate some of that with ranks and I assume t…

The LLM posts that I'm looking at are definitely coming from normal-user IP addresses. There are exceptions, but the rate of those doesn't seem higher than usual. Outright bot/agent posting, as far as we can tell (and we may be wrong!) seems to have down-ticked since the flurry earlier this year (openclaw and so on). My gut feeling is that this issue isn't much affected by voting rings, which is too bad, because we h…

> coming from normal-user IP addresses

This is the standard now for astroturfing online. Build up a profile over time with varied interactions, sometimes over years, and then sell it for a few hundred dollars via blackhatworld. I've not seen hn listed but reddit definitely follows this pattern.

If you think the IPs are normal, you can check if people are proxying by looking at DNS connecting IP (they may not have proxied UDP), SIMD score (server CPUs cluster differently to consumer), residential proxy lists (there are a bunch of these), invalid webgpu setups, etc. Maybe this kind of detection is against HN way of doing things but I've definitely seen recaptcha on the login before and it employs a bunch of these checks. Happy to help!

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#42

Post by Bender »

arbol wrote: post #41
dang wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The LLM posts that I'm looking at are definitely coming from normal-user IP addresses. There are exceptions, but the rate of those doesn't seem higher than usual. Outright bot/agent posting, as far as we can tell (and we may be wrong!) seems to have down-ticked since the flurry earlier this year (openclaw and so on). My gut feeling is that this issue isn't much affected by voting rings, which is too bad, because we h…

> coming from normal-user IP addresses This is the standard now for astroturfing online. Build up a profile over time with varied interactions, sometimes over years, and then sell it for a few hundred dollars via blackhatworld. I've not seen hn listed but reddit definitely follows this pattern. If you think the IPs are normal, you can check if people are proxying by looking at DNS connecting IP (they may not have pro…

Adding to this some of those proxied connections will be HTTP/1.1 and not HTTP/2.0 like normal clients. Sometimes the MSS of their TCP SYN packets will be just a little lower than 1460. Some of them are also missing the client header for sec-fetch-mode. Blocking HTTP/1.1 to the non API port/url should slow down some of the nonsense. Many API clients still use HTTP/1.1.

In NGinx as an example in the Location for the non-API url:

    if ($server_protocol != HTTP/2.0) { return 403 'Browser Error.'; }

    if ($http_sec_fetch_mode !~ (cors|no-cors|navigate) ) { return 403 'Error: Flux Capacitor Under-Current.'; }

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#43

Post by [deleted] »

dang wrote: post #11
byoung2 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The recent batches all use the following formulas which I don't find particularly interesting: AI native ______ for _______ ______ for AI agents AI _______ for _______ https://www.ycombinator.com/companies?batch=Winter%202027&ba...

Isn't that how every major tech wave works? "Thing, but for $X" is what everyone was doing when $X was personal computing, the web, mobile.

[deleted]

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#44

Post by 4lx87 »

dang wrote: post #11
byoung2 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The recent batches all use the following formulas which I don't find particularly interesting: AI native ______ for _______ ______ for AI agents AI _______ for _______ https://www.ycombinator.com/companies?batch=Winter%202027&ba...

Isn't that how every major tech wave works? "Thing, but for $X" is what everyone was doing when $X was personal computing, the web, mobile.

[flagged]

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#45

Post by byoung2 »

dang wrote: post #32
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but how many of those were YC-worthy?

"$Foo for $Bar" has always been a common formula for startups that are just getting going, including in YC. I think you guys are rewriting the past a bit here.

Correct $Foo for $Bar was common back then but I made the subtle distinction between "TikTok for Math Tutors" ([solution] for [audience served]) where naming a startup in a different vertical is a shortcut for the solution, and what we see now which is "AI agents for Banking" ([technology] for [industry]) where naming the technology doesn't make it clear what the problem or solution is, and the industry doesn't necessarily say who has the problem or needs the solution.

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#46

Post by david927 »

dang wrote: post #32
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but how many of those were YC-worthy?

"$Foo for $Bar" has always been a common formula for startups that are just getting going, including in YC. I think you guys are rewriting the past a bit here.

I have to defer, you're a lot closer to these things than I am, but I remember since the 90's the "this-for-that" analogies were around and became hot at some point, so that you were even encouraged by some to put it into that form for a while.

Where I see a difference is that it used to be about creating unique combinations and now it's more about deployment. "What about the known tool for this market?" It's banal. I can honestly say, it's not that I don't remember -- I do -- it's that I'm waiting and hoping to get excited about a startup again.

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#47

Post by dang »

akkartik wrote: post #36
dang wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2008 is good! Now I want to know what was the first comment saying HN was going downhill. A few years ago I did a thorough search for "HN is turning into Reddit" posts so I could link them at the bottom of https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html . These 4 predate your July 2008 link (the first one by only 6 days): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=253657 (July 2008) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=66…

HN has always had sucky bits, just like human nature. Everyone who thinks it's going downhill is just one of today's 10,000 [1] to discover some sucky corner of human nature. I'd say the world has gone downhill much faster and is making HN look good in comparison. [1] https://xkcd.com/1053

That's the "we don't have to outrun the bear" theory of HN, which is my favorite theory of HN.

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#48

Post by dang »

big_toast wrote: post #22
dang wrote: post #7

This perception has been around for almost as long as HN itself: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12213869 (Aug 2016) Examples are legion. Here are a couple others: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32229249 (July 2022) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23920281 (July 2020) I don't know of any way to objectively measure this. I do know that there's a strong bias to believe that things were better in the pas…

pg had his 'pending comments'[0] a long time ago. I think you work so hard for everyone here. Maybe it's a kind of cultural gardening. [0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7445761

I appreciate the gardening metaphor - it's one of my favorites too!

https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12960048

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20250918

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32771735

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#49

Post by byoung2 »

david927 wrote: post #46
dang wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"$Foo for $Bar" has always been a common formula for startups that are just getting going, including in YC. I think you guys are rewriting the past a bit here.

I have to defer, you're a lot closer to these things than I am, but I remember since the 90's the "this-for-that" analogies were around and became hot at some point, so that you were even encouraged by some to put it into that form for a while. Where I see a difference is that it used to be about creating unique combinations and now it's more about deployment. "What about the known tool for this market?" It's banal.…

Yeah I remember the "X for Y" format being encouraged [1]. But X was always an example of a successful startup that was a leader in one category/audience, and you were saying you would be the X for a different category or audience.

PG's examples here were AirBnB as the "Ebay for space" or Viaweb as "the Microsoft Word of Ecommerce".

I'm not rewriting history when I say that the X has changed from a representative example of a successful company to a lazy broad technology like "AI agent for insurance" or "AI native recruiting". Here is a current YC batch startup: Manicule - AI Native Developer Relations. I have no Idea what that is. Does it talk to devs using my product like in a chatbot? Does it help them write code using AI? If they said "HubSpot for developer content" or "Vercel for developer relations" I would get it right away. But better than the X for Y formula would be just to describe the startup: we provide an AI-native developer relations team that owns documentation and technical content end-to-end so you don't have to hire someone for $300k.

  1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6866822

Re: HN seems dead compared to say 10-15 years ago

#50

Post by mirmor23 »

morpheos137 wrote: post #30
mirmor23 wrote: post #15

recently, you were rambling on-and-on about how netbsd was not a good desktop setup, even though netbsd primary usecase is embedded systems. nobody owes you anything; so just read threads that are interesting and ignore the rest; if that is not acceptable, why don't you be the change you wish to see in the world?

Nobody owes me anything. Absolutely agree. I more read than contribute. Making an observation is not asserting an entitlement. I am only asseying it seems in the past the forum was more dynamic.

my apologies for being needlessly abrasive. wishing you the best.
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