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It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

unix.foo

41–50 of 79 posts

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#41

I would like to see a non-big-corp-controlled (e.g. Open source) OS that is focused on single-user systems. (Personal /"Desktop" computers) ABI compatibilty, no sudo or permissions; "just works". Schedule software, provide a GUI, threads, memory allocation etc. But get out of the way; no complicated user system; no delicate balance of text config files scattered throughout a file system. Currently, OSS (etc) OSes are…

Sounds like TempleOS checks all those boxes. You might miss networking though.

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#42
Yeahhhh…this is not really how Linux works, though.

Most of LLM world is kind of anti-linux right now because the most popular LLMs are walled off by these huge companies and hella expensive. At some point, a nerd will realize they could hack together a surprisingly ok homebrew version of what everybody else is using, and do. Then a company realizes that they can build a brand on the anarchist, grassroots vibe of the homebrew thing, and capitalize its development (software development, but also community development, which is brand development for the company). Now, it’s much later, but the open source thing is competitive, and popular for being open-source.

At one point I got interested in why Red Hat handed over tens of millions of dollars in stock to Linus leading up to their IPO, in exchange for…nothing specific. Nominally it was a gift of appreciation, but handing out random gifts is somewhat opposed to maximizing shareholder returns. It’s because Linus controls merges to the Linux kernel and doesn’t have to care about Red Hat, and the board wanted him to care at least a little bit. They were stuck between “people trust our business because it’s built on this populist OS” and “this populist OS is mostly controlled by a guy who doesn’t work for us.” It’s hard to have one without the other.

I’m glad Apple is taking accessibility seriously, and I wish accessibility worked better on Linux, but I don’t think Linux is ever going to make developers “do their homework,” because the community wouldn’t trust a Linux like that. If the author is right, it’ll happen because “AI for the People, Inc.” builds a business on it and sponsors the work.

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#43
post #41

I would like to see a non-big-corp-controlled (e.g. Open source) OS that is focused on single-user systems. (Personal /"Desktop" computers) ABI compatibilty, no sudo or permissions; "just works". Schedule software, provide a GUI, threads, memory allocation etc. But get out of the way; no complicated user system; no delicate balance of text config files scattered throughout a file system. Currently, OSS (etc) OSes are…

Sounds like TempleOS checks all those boxes. You might miss networking though.

I appreciate the rec! Hah; networking is indeed one of the things I think it would be good for a GPOS to have (e.g. fits with threads, allocator etc). Also interfaces for the MB's RTC for datetimes etc... Some day?

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#44

I don't see why AI agents need to use the GUI very much? If anything, all the major advances with AI agents have been in CLI domains that Linux is perfectly well adapted to. Besides, surely AI agents could just contribute code allowing them to use Linux, no?

Because there is a world of software out there that isn't CLI-based and much of it may never be updated to expose LLM-friendly APIs.

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#45
Coding agents run well in a Linux VM and you can run Linux in a VM just about anywhere. A coding agent can be bundled with tools in a Docker file, or it can apt-get lots of useful tools if it needs to. They don’t need a desktop or desktop apps. Why go through an accessibility tree when you can make http requests?

So I expect that we will see more and more Linux VM’s. Maybe it will be like Sqlite, ubiquitous but hidden?

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#46

The thing is: it already is the year of the Linux Desktop for me. I don't care about 'OS market share' or how many people use something; I have no control over them. I also don't care about "OS-maxxing", either--quibbling over 'Wayland', or which OS has the best window manager, arguing about 'gaming', etc. What I do care about? Freedom and control. Linux gives me that. So my desktop? It's Linux. The Year of Linux on…

> What I do care about? Freedom and control. Linux gives me that.

I think a lot of this comes down to what we're looking for out of an OS. For example, it is orthogonal to what I care about most: "Provides a low friction interface between my body and arbitrary software"

Relevant: I do think about the freedom and control aspect about computing; I (personally) tie it to the software or hardware design instead of the interface. Or in some cases, the use of creative software. (DAW, CAD, document writers etc)

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#47
For me the Year of the Linux Desktop is every year since around 2000.

I dual booted Windows since 95, also tried Mac OSX on $job but nothing comes close to the peace of mind of using Linux.

I have lived through spotty hardware support (fixed), install editing too many files (fixed), no games (fixed) and several other problems, but even in the worst of times it is a software that respects you as a user.

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#48

The thing is: it already is the year of the Linux Desktop for me. I don't care about 'OS market share' or how many people use something; I have no control over them. I also don't care about "OS-maxxing", either--quibbling over 'Wayland', or which OS has the best window manager, arguing about 'gaming', etc. What I do care about? Freedom and control. Linux gives me that. So my desktop? It's Linux. The Year of Linux on…

I love Linux and think it's better than ever to have Linux as your daily driver, especially thanks to the work of Valve with Proton, but I'm gonna be real and say "the year of the Linux Desktop is a personal journey" is a retrofit. The "Year of the Linux Desktop" meme came out of Slashdot in the 90s/early 00s where people were insisting that Linux was due to overtake Windows as the way an average, non-technical user interacted with a computer.

Of course, this did turn out to be true... in the form of Android, which is maybe the most monkeys-paw-curling way YotLD could possibly happen.

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#49

I don't see why AI agents need to use the GUI very much? If anything, all the major advances with AI agents have been in CLI domains that Linux is perfectly well adapted to. Besides, surely AI agents could just contribute code allowing them to use Linux, no?

Because there is a world of software out there that isn't CLI-based and much of it may never be updated to expose LLM-friendly APIs.

Of course, but how many of those are really relevant for AI agents/couldn't be done through another means.

Re: It Will Never Be the Year of the Linux Desktop

#50
post #11

"On Linux under Wayland" is a big part of the problem. On X11 a significant part of missing "GUI-exposed-as-api" is present. If we concede (and I think otherwise) that we need a FOSS operating system and desktop experience to be fully on par with competitors and offer agentic-first options, I think that an open-minded developer (or one that can afford to run a fairly good LLM on local machine), presented with the pro…

Wayland is a major regression for accessibility. People have been raising that for years, but always shouted down by the brigade with the motte-and-bailey seesaw between “Wayland replaces X11” and “Wayland is just a protocol”.
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