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Social Animus

justine.lol

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Re: Social Animus

#41

Post by kelnos »

It was very odd to me that she never actually says what the views or beliefs are that has gotten her into trouble with so many people.

But after digging a little more, it seems she is (was? still is?) a techno-fascist in the vein of Curtis Yarvin, and, among other things, earnestly believes that the USA's form of "government" should be corporate despotism, having petitioned the White House to retire all government employees, make Eric Schmidt the "CEO of America", and turn control over administering the US to the tech industry[0].

In a way, I feel duped reading this all the way through. Throughout the post, she dances around the topic of what people found objectionable about her, and then brings up transphobia in a way that makes it seem like gender-identity discrimination is what's going on. But wow, what a dishonest way to present all this. Classic way to build feelings of sympathy when it's not deserved.

Maybe her first order of business should be actually addressing the techno-fascist stuff. If she doesn't still hold those views, she needs to say so, and tell us why she believes she was misguided. If she still does hold those views then, well... nothing has really changed, and IMO the reason some people are uncomfortable working with her is entirely valid, regardless of how impressive her technical achievements are.

Oh, and being one of the top 300 GitHub users doesn't put you in the 99.9997th percentile of open source developers, or that you're "uniquely able to convert your money into the largest amount of value for society". I'm fine with people accurately describing their achievements and capabilities and a no-nonsense manner, but this just smacks of delusions of grandeur.

[0] https://thebaffler.com/latest/mouthbreathing-machiavellis

Re: Social Animus

#42

Post by kelnos »

dreambuffer wrote: post #15

This post resonates with my situation very much, although I have not made even a tiny fraction of the contributions this person has. I think if a person like this is struggling to find work, but the donkeys who code my government's dysfunctional websites are all fully employed, it suggests the software industry is in very big trouble. That being said, and speaking from my own experience, one can develop ego problems…

This isn't an ego problem (though I think she may additionally have an ego problem). The author has espoused techno-fascist views (something she avoids actually mentioning in this post), and that seems to be the real reason why many people are uncomfortable working with her.

Re: Social Animus

#43

Post by kelnos »

cassepipe wrote: post #26
MisterTea wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've noticed in past threads these are brought up but she does not address them, which strikes me as lacking the courage that she usually has. The reason is a massive ego problem they refuse to address. Reading this difficult to follow rant also reveals they no clue what it means to be humble.

I don't think people have to be humble if they are proud of what they have produced and get recognition to validate them. I am much more concerned by her holding views that are in favor of hurting others.

Those two things aren't incompatible: you can be humble, and simultaneously speak frankly (and without ego) about your accomplishments.

Re: Social Animus

#44

Post by [deleted] »

skware wrote: post #12

There appear to be some inaccuracies, or at least motivated misinterpretations in this article. In the second paragraph she claims that her invitation to speak at the Internet Archive was cancelled because of the llama.cpp incident, but reading the actual text of the email it seems the bigger issue is the content of the neoreactionary statements she made in 2014-2015? In fact, nowhere in the text of the article itsel…

[deleted]

Re: Social Animus

#45

Post by kelnos »

jawns wrote: post #32

I've read this type of writing before, and I associate it strongly with manic episodes and autistic hyper fixation. It veers from topic to topic with abrupt transitions, developing tenuous threads to support perceived grievances and slights, and every once in a while goes fully off the hinges. There are delusions of grandeur -- "One of the issues I have is that I'm so popular on Hacker News that people there don't cr…

> manic episodes and autistic hyper fixation.

I generally try very very very hard to resist armchair-diagnosing people, but it was also very hard for me not to get that impression as well. She seems hyper fixated on people's reactions to her, without examining -- or even telling us -- why people are uncomfortable working with her.

I had to look elsewhere to learn that she's espoused techno-fascist views in the past. She should have been honest about that up-front in her article, and, assuming she no longer holds those views, say so, and explain what happened to change her mind. If she does still hold those views, then... well, I can see why people continue to not want to be associated with her.

Re: Social Animus

#48

Post by esperent »

Someone else mentioned that her problems are more likely stemming from her involvement in the neoreactionary (alt-right) movement circa 2015.

I've never heard of this and generally would say people should be given space to grow from things they said ten years ago... But...

> The Dark Enlightenment, also called the Neo-Reactionary movement (abbreviated to NRx), is an anti-democratic, anti-egalitarian,[1] and reactionary philosophical and political movement

> The Dark Enlightenment has been described as part of the alt-right, as its theoretical branch,[15][16] and as neo-fascist.[15][17] It has been described as the most significant political theory within the alt-right,[2] as "key to understanding" the alt-right political ideology

> The Dark Enlightenment has been described as part of the alt-right, as its theoretical branch,[15][16] and as neo-fascist.[15][17] It has been described as the most significant political theory within the alt-right,[2] as "key to understanding" the alt-right political ideology

And it continues with gems like "freedom is incompatible with democracy" and so on.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Enlightenment

It's not like she made a few of the cuff statements here. She was so deeply involved in this movement that people were writing articles about her.

> And then there’s Justine Tunney, “co-founder of Occupy,” proud Google employee and self-declared defender of the tech elite.

Tunney does not just flirt with neoreactionary ideology, the way self-congratulatory “open-minded iconoclasts” like me did in high school and college. She goes full throttle in her embrace of it, doubles down on it, rejects every “politically correct” rejection of sexism or racism or classism that define the modern world.

She makes bold statements that IQ, law-abiding or -breaking tendencies and political alignment are all genetically determined.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/occupying-the-throne-justine-t...

As someone else mentioned below, this is why she was uninvited from speaking at the Internet Archive. It seems the llama.cpp drama had little if anything to do with it.

At the very least, if she has grown beyond this, I would expect or rather need her to acknowledge it and distance herself and explain how and why she's grown since then. Otherwise, I can only assume that she hasn't and is still basically that same trollish reactionary from 2015 and that's not someone I would want either working at my company or speaking at my convention.

Re: Social Animus

#50

Post by austhrow743 »

dreambuffer wrote: post #15

This post resonates with my situation very much, although I have not made even a tiny fraction of the contributions this person has. I think if a person like this is struggling to find work, but the donkeys who code my government's dysfunctional websites are all fully employed, it suggests the software industry is in very big trouble. That being said, and speaking from my own experience, one can develop ego problems…

I didn’t get that they’re struggling to find work from the article. Did I miss something?
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