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Lost in translation: The linguistic challenges facing N. Korean defectors (2025)

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Re: Lost in translation: The linguistic challenges facing N. Korean defectors (2025)

#41

Post by pndy »

anthk wrote: post #6

Eh, Spanish has the same issues across the pond and everyone adapts quickly. Móvil/Celular -cell phone- Camarero/Mesero -waiter- Tiroteo/Balacera -shooting- Nevera/Heladera -freezer- Cacahuete/Maní -peanut- Coche/Carro -car- (In Iberian Spanish carro it's a old carriage) Ordenador/Computadora (Computador was used in Ib. Spa. long ago maybe in 1960's and 1970's). And -computación (computing) it's used on formal, acade…

> Móvil/Celular -cell phone-

Can't tell if something has changed after 20 years when I was last time watching satellite tv, but German used to call phone "handy"

Re: Lost in translation: The linguistic challenges facing N. Korean defectors (2025)

#42

Post by melagonster »

jdw64 wrote: post #5

Reading this article, I found myself agreeing with more of it than I expected, even as a Korean-language speaker. There are words that are used differently in North Korea and South Korea, but even within South Korean Korean, the sentence endings, vocabulary, and phrasing you should use can change a lot depending on the situation. The basic structure may be similar, but small differences matter. Vocabulary changes dep…

My first language is Chinese. I found that even the order of sentence leaks information, too.

Re: Lost in translation: The linguistic challenges facing N. Korean defectors (2025)

#43

Post by orangeboats »

t-3 wrote: post #33
shlewis wrote: post #20

Imo as a Korean speaker, the thing about North Korean Korean is that it sounds much more aggressive, from the words to the general tone. They’re also usually much more direct, and in a lot of North Korean defector stories I’ve read, that has been a common pain point for them.

Is that something new (divergence since the political split), or an older regional dialect thing that is now more obvious due to the political situation?

Communist governments often prefer to use expressions that are more down-to-earth and colloquial, due to their populist root.

It could be related to that, or just a matter of North-South dialectal differences I guess.

Re: Lost in translation: The linguistic challenges facing N. Korean defectors (2025)

#44

Post by GreenDolphinSys »

shlewis wrote: post #27
GreenDolphinSys wrote: post #25

> Unlike North Korea, South Korean society extensively uses loanwords in technology, finance, and culture. English-derived words like “computer,” “café,” and “internet” are ubiquitous in the South but virtually unknown in the North, creating challenges for defectors encountering them for the first time. This is tangential to the topic at hand, but as a Korean learner of ~9 years, it's maddening just how many English…

This is an extreme level of pedantry(forgive me), but there is a subtle difference between "DC" and "할인" (and also "세일"). "할인" refers to a wide variety of discounts: it may have a few conditions (minimum quantity, membership, etc.), be available only for a certain period of time, or be a fixed amount or percentage. "세일" is pretty much the same, although it puts a tiny bit more focus on being a limited-time offer and…

No need for forgiveness, I appreciate the pedantry and explanations. Personal grips aside, I'm forever a student of the language.

Re: Lost in translation: The linguistic challenges facing N. Korean defectors (2025)

#45

Post by GreenDolphinSys »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #39
GreenDolphinSys wrote: post #25

> Unlike North Korea, South Korean society extensively uses loanwords in technology, finance, and culture. English-derived words like “computer,” “café,” and “internet” are ubiquitous in the South but virtually unknown in the North, creating challenges for defectors encountering them for the first time. This is tangential to the topic at hand, but as a Korean learner of ~9 years, it's maddening just how many English…

> In addition to pure Korean words, there's a surfeit of Sino-Korean (Chinese-derived), or Hanja words. Both of these are beautiful, and then the English loanwords stick out like a sore thumb. Any chance the English loanwords stick out to you and the Chinese ones don't because you can recognize English words but not Chinese words? I can recognize many Sino-Korean words and zero Korean words, so I tend to think of the…

The Sino-Korean words stand out, but in a beautiful sense to my ears/eyes. It helps that they're generally short at 2 syllables and are represented nicely with the Hangeul script. Given that they make up about 57% of the Korean language [0], they're unavoidable.

English/German loanwords just stick out due to there being fewer of them, and they look atrocious in Hangeul, like little dirt islands in a sea of pure Korean and Sino-Korean words.

Since I study Hanja I imagine Sino-Korean words stick out a bit more for me, but I think anyone who's studied Korean for a while can get a sense of the two major groups. They just sound very different.

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Korean_vocabulary

Re: Lost in translation: The linguistic challenges facing N. Korean defectors (2025)

#46

Post by expedition32 »

simonask wrote: post #16
ninalanyon wrote: post #3

It doesn't make a convincing case to me. The differences cited seem no more, perhaps less than the differences between Danish, Norwegian, and Swedish which are, at least officially, distinct languages not dialects but are nonetheless largely mutually intelligible for many native speakers. And I'll bet that "Modern slang expressions — enthusiastically adopted by younger generations" is also difficult for elderly South…

Yeah, but I will point out that Sweden, Norway, and Denmark are also countries with incredibly similar political cultures, economic systems, societal norms, cultural values, and so on. I wouldn’t be surprised if the culture shock between DPRK and SK is much bigger after 70 years of tyranny and oppression.

Those Scandinavian countries fought with eachother for centuries.

I find it really weird when Danish suddenly pretend Norwegians are their long lost brothers.

Re: Lost in translation: The linguistic challenges facing N. Korean defectors (2025)

#47

Post by simonask »

expedition32 wrote: post #46
simonask wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but I will point out that Sweden, Norway, and Denmark are also countries with incredibly similar political cultures, economic systems, societal norms, cultural values, and so on. I wouldn’t be surprised if the culture shock between DPRK and SK is much bigger after 70 years of tyranny and oppression.

Those Scandinavian countries fought with eachother for centuries. I find it really weird when Danish suddenly pretend Norwegians are their long lost brothers.

Sweden and Denmark fought for centuries. Sometimes over Norway, sometimes over other areas, mostly over petty squabbles.

This is not a thing that affect current relations between the countries in any way, and hasn’t since Norway’s (deserved) independence. Don’t make the mistake of confusing sibling banter with international relations.

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