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MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

blog.meshcore.io

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Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#41

Post by nonethewiser »

mtlynch wrote: post #22

> Would you trust AI generated mesh firmware ? It's ridiculous to me that they're concerned about the trustworthiness of AI-generated code when their code quality is so low. They don't even have automated tests and ignore attempts to add them.[0, 1, 2, 3] Last I checked, there's little validity checking in the code, so it's possible to broadcast nonsense values (like GPS coordinates outside of Earth's bounds) and the…

>Would you trust AI generated mesh firmware?

This is also a loaded question. The only specifics they've offered are that he simply used Claude Code. Um... OK? Do the tests pass? Did his changes add any security flaws? Regressions that were untested?

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#42

Post by mtlynch »

jstanley wrote: post #39
mtlynch wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A longitude that's outside the range of [-180, +180] or a latitude that's outside the range of [-90, +90].

Ok but that would still be on earth

What do you mean? Is the non-existent millionth floor of the Empire State Building still part of the Empire State Building?

Also, I'm assuming we're in agreement that software should not accept invalid GPS coordinates from untrusted peers regardless of semantics about whether or not they're within Earth's bounds.

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#43

Post by celsoazevedo »

Trannosaur wrote: post #2

What is it with mesh projects and having these super draconian trademark enforcers? Meshtastic is the same. One of the main reasons I got interested in MeshCore was reading the Meshtastic trademark rules and just finding them... really really over the top.

For now, I don't think it's fair to compare MeshCore with MeshTastic in terms of enforcement as that has not happened with MeshCore. This seems to be one guy getting a trademark in the UK without the approval of other members of the team. They're not going after anyone. Not yet, at least.

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#44

Post by prism56 »

nonethewiser wrote: post #40

>We have always been wary of AI generated code, but felt everyone is free to do what they want and experiment, etc. But, one of our own, Andy Kirby, decided to branch out and extensively use Claude Code, and has decided to aggressively take over all of the components of the MeshCore ecosystem: standalone devices, mobile app, web flasher and web config tools. >And, he’s kept that small detail a secret - that it’s all…

Agreed. I use meshcore and have multiple repeaters setup. I don't care about people using ai assisted coding but I think it should be disclosed especially if its closed source.

Now the trademark take over seems crazy especially given Andy hasn't contributed to the github project, only personal for profit add ons.

I do also think that the meshcore core team have "tacked on" and tried to enforce a stronger narrative with their anti ai coding bias.

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#45

Post by celsoazevedo »

amatecha wrote: post #16
tbyehl wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know any of the players but I'd bet they're licensed amateur radio operators.

Actually the opposite, tons of ppl in the meshtastic community (Discord) berate amateur radio operators. I stopped even discussing the subject because of how much derision I observed or was subjected to. Lots of insults and nasty jokes in passing as soon as the topic even comes up whatsoever. Kinda like your post, actually - offhanded derogatory remarks about an entire group of people solely because of the hobby they…

The person in question has many radios in the background of his videos, so maybe the comment you've replied to is into something :P

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#46

Post by celsoazevedo »

sidewndr46 wrote: post #12
queenkjuul wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, very surprised to learn that it is closed source, and that's probably not changing. My local mesh was testing out meshcore last week, this definitely kills my interest too

This reduced my interest to zero in this as well, when I learned it was closed source

Search for "meshcore-open". It's an open client, still in alpha, but already does many of the basics. Github only for now, I believe.

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#47

Post by randerson »

NooneAtAll3 wrote: post #37
mtlynch wrote: post #22

> Would you trust AI generated mesh firmware ? It's ridiculous to me that they're concerned about the trustworthiness of AI-generated code when their code quality is so low. They don't even have automated tests and ignore attempts to add them.[0, 1, 2, 3] Last I checked, there's little validity checking in the code, so it's possible to broadcast nonsense values (like GPS coordinates outside of Earth's bounds) and the…

what's even the need to transmit/receive GPS as part of the protocol?

Its optional but it helps to see where nodes are on a map, and would be useful in (for example) a search & rescue operation.

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#48

Post by CyberDildonics »

desireco42 wrote: post #7

I love using AI to develop and I think it is important in modern development, but you definitely have to disclose it because there is a difference between AI and human written code is key. It is essential to disclose it.

You're right, I don't know who would down vote or disagree with this. It's not easy to figure out what a program is doing, but if someone wrote it you at least know there was some sort of intention there. With AI you have no idea why it's there.

All over the internet people are putting up vibe coded projects and no one says that's what it is up front. They all just say "I made this" and they are more than happy to take in the adulation of people impressed that they made something with an animated pattern.

Then when they finally admit that they wrote nothing and don't know how any of it works people start to say "nothing wrong with using ai", as if using it is the same as copying it verbatim, not understanding anything and taking complete credit as if you wrote it while lying about how it was used.

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#49

Post by CyberDildonics »

mtlynch wrote: post #42
jstanley wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok but that would still be on earth

What do you mean? Is the non-existent millionth floor of the Empire State Building still part of the Empire State Building? Also, I'm assuming we're in agreement that software should not accept invalid GPS coordinates from untrusted peers regardless of semantics about whether or not they're within Earth's bounds.

What do you mean? Is the non-existent millionth floor of the Empire State Building still part of the Empire State Building?

Circular coordinates wrap around, cartesian coordinates don't.

Re: MeshCore development team splits over trademark dispute and AI-generated code

#50

Post by linsomniac »

tbyehl wrote: post #4
Trannosaur wrote: post #2

What is it with mesh projects and having these super draconian trademark enforcers? Meshtastic is the same. One of the main reasons I got interested in MeshCore was reading the Meshtastic trademark rules and just finding them... really really over the top.

I don't know any of the players but I'd bet they're licensed amateur radio operators.

I will say in Northern Colorado a LOT of the people involved in the MeshCore are HAMs.
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