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Training mRNA Language Models Across 25 Species for $165

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Training mRNA Language Models Across 25 Species for $165

#41

Post by CyberDildonics »

xyz100 wrote: post #40
CyberDildonics wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you talking about? "the phenomenon of interest"? There is nothing you wrote in either comment that makes sense. What is a "dataset" that has been "solved" and what did the program do that 'solved' it?

MNIST (the number classification task) has been “solved” a billion times and it is hard to imagine any subsequent advances there as scores using a variety of methods have hit the saturation point of accuracy. Any further improvements are likely overfitting to noise. Therefore, we know that it is easy to detect handwritten numbers. However, we may not know how to detect other things as well, like reading an MRI. Those…

has been “solved” a billion times

If it was really solved, wouldn't it just need to happen once?

You think classifying handwriting of 10 numbers is the same as this that took 55 hours of GPU time for someone to go through?

I have no idea what point you're trying to make and I can't tell if you do either. You were talking about "solving" other "health datasets" but you can't even come up with one or what that means.

Re: Training mRNA Language Models Across 25 Species for $165

#42

Post by basyt »

CyberDildonics wrote: post #41
xyz100 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MNIST (the number classification task) has been “solved” a billion times and it is hard to imagine any subsequent advances there as scores using a variety of methods have hit the saturation point of accuracy. Any further improvements are likely overfitting to noise. Therefore, we know that it is easy to detect handwritten numbers. However, we may not know how to detect other things as well, like reading an MRI. Those…

has been “solved” a billion times If it was really solved, wouldn't it just need to happen once? You think classifying handwriting of 10 numbers is the same as this that took 55 hours of GPU time for someone to go through? I have no idea what point you're trying to make and I can't tell if you do either. You were talking about "solving" other "health datasets" but you can't even come up with one or what that means.

yeah lol no shit. lets not get bothered by reactionaries...

Re: Training mRNA Language Models Across 25 Species for $165

#44

Post by xyz100 »

CyberDildonics wrote: post #41
xyz100 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MNIST (the number classification task) has been “solved” a billion times and it is hard to imagine any subsequent advances there as scores using a variety of methods have hit the saturation point of accuracy. Any further improvements are likely overfitting to noise. Therefore, we know that it is easy to detect handwritten numbers. However, we may not know how to detect other things as well, like reading an MRI. Those…

has been “solved” a billion times If it was really solved, wouldn't it just need to happen once? You think classifying handwriting of 10 numbers is the same as this that took 55 hours of GPU time for someone to go through? I have no idea what point you're trying to make and I can't tell if you do either. You were talking about "solving" other "health datasets" but you can't even come up with one or what that means.

If you want to be literal with language, then do you ever really “solve” anything? Even tying your shoes is not solved. One day you may tie them better, but for practical purposes we can say it is solved.

Likewise, you can spend 55 hours of GPU time to produce very different things. Can those 55 hours cure cancer? Definitely not. Can it pick up correlations with a small subset of proteins that are perhaps not representative of practical problems? Probably. Can it learn a pattern to tie your shoes, given all your life experiences tying them? Sure.

I asked the question to determine what is the impact of the task and dataset. Curing cancer is huge, tying shoes is not. What are the strengths and limitations?

Re: Training mRNA Language Models Across 25 Species for $165

#45

Post by CyberDildonics »

xyz100 wrote: post #44
CyberDildonics wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

has been “solved” a billion times If it was really solved, wouldn't it just need to happen once? You think classifying handwriting of 10 numbers is the same as this that took 55 hours of GPU time for someone to go through? I have no idea what point you're trying to make and I can't tell if you do either. You were talking about "solving" other "health datasets" but you can't even come up with one or what that means.

If you want to be literal with language, then do you ever really “solve” anything? Even tying your shoes is not solved. One day you may tie them better, but for practical purposes we can say it is solved. Likewise, you can spend 55 hours of GPU time to produce very different things. Can those 55 hours cure cancer? Definitely not. Can it pick up correlations with a small subset of proteins that are perhaps not represe…

If you want to be literal with language, then do you ever really “solve” anything?

You are the one who said it and you can't even explain what you meant, you just get mad that anyone would ask.

Re: Training mRNA Language Models Across 25 Species for $165

#46

Post by xyz100 »

CyberDildonics wrote: post #41
xyz100 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MNIST (the number classification task) has been “solved” a billion times and it is hard to imagine any subsequent advances there as scores using a variety of methods have hit the saturation point of accuracy. Any further improvements are likely overfitting to noise. Therefore, we know that it is easy to detect handwritten numbers. However, we may not know how to detect other things as well, like reading an MRI. Those…

has been “solved” a billion times If it was really solved, wouldn't it just need to happen once? You think classifying handwriting of 10 numbers is the same as this that took 55 hours of GPU time for someone to go through? I have no idea what point you're trying to make and I can't tell if you do either. You were talking about "solving" other "health datasets" but you can't even come up with one or what that means.

Since I am hitting the reply depth: You “solve” a dataset or task when you translate some model into actual real world problems by creating a model that actually “works” (not just high accuracy). What is otherwise the point of training the model other than writing blog posts? Second to that, you can train a model that performs well on the dataset but is less useful in the real world.

This is a health dataset, there are many inputs and outputs to health (e.g., cell level, protein level, tumors, organs, etc.). In this case, it is mRNA focused, which is a broad category that translates to potentially immune responses like vaccines (exactly what kind of therapy, I’m not sure other than “25 species”). Once the model is trained, you can use it to solve real problems, perhaps to develop a therapy that makes its way to clinical trials and eventually actually treats some disease. The model by itself is useless without the ability to have that impact.

So for other examples, take any disease (e.g., Covid19), create a dataset to mirror that problem using some technique (e.g., Covid19 mRNA prediction of some sort), and solve it to create a treatment (e.g., get a safe and effective vaccine). Obviously, you can say the vaccine can be improved so it is not “solved”, but most people would be quite happy with a “almost cure for cancer” even if it wasn’t literally optimal (we don’t even know if a cure for cancer is possible).

My suggestion and question to the author is to outline what is the implications of the work rather than focusing on accuracy statistics that are meaningless without such context.

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