Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

wero-wallet.eu

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 141 posts

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#41

Post by linohh »

cyberpunk wrote: post #35
mzajc wrote: post #7

From what I've gathered, they've decided to make this completely unusable without a Google- or Apple-approved smartphone. Horrible! Are individual banks even allowed to make that an option for clients? Though even if they are, I doubt any will. I would LOVE a PayPal alternative, but this is just not it. -- From https://support.wero-wallet.eu/hc/en-us/articles/25599074240... : > It is not possible to use Wero via a we…

This is a regulatory thing, devices used for instant payments should be somehow attested and be authenticated (or be a physical device the bank issued e.g your card). It’s a difficult thing, we don’t want to have to force smartphone choices but the number of users without one these devices is so vanishingly small it’s very difficult to change the legislation in order to support them too. I think the happy middle grou…

I don't see, why a smartphone plus NFC enabled token device wouldn't work within the regulation, we should go that way, (or any way decoupling Google & Co. from it) because we should be prepared for US companies to be forced to act unreasonably by an unreasonable leader.

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#42

Post by pbreit »

Freak_NL wrote: post #28
dadoum wrote: post #18

Can anyone explain me exactly why it is a suitable alternative to VISA and Mastercard (and why people were waiting for it). I am trying to understand the full picture here, so multiple things come to my mind. First, SEPA instant payments already exist and are really instant up to a certain amount, and I am guessing that Wero builds on top of that a sort of identity layer, to sidestep the whole IBAN thing. But it is l…

It's really simple. You're in the Netherlands, and you are going to buy something in an on-line store. Steam perhaps, or any Dutch retailer. You put the game in your Steam cart, and go to pay. You select Ideal (which Steam provides as an option), you pick your bank, and you follow the on-screen instructions (but you probably do that pretty much automatically). Usually that means scanning a QR code with your bank app…

How is that better than a card payment? Cards are accepted by far more merchants, have dispute rights, are inexpensive (in Europe) to process, supported by Apple & Google Pay, superior checkout experience, etc.

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#44

Post by mzajc »

microtonal wrote: post #30
mzajc wrote: post #7

From what I've gathered, they've decided to make this completely unusable without a Google- or Apple-approved smartphone. Horrible! Are individual banks even allowed to make that an option for clients? Though even if they are, I doubt any will. I would LOVE a PayPal alternative, but this is just not it. -- From https://support.wero-wallet.eu/hc/en-us/articles/25599074240... : > It is not possible to use Wero via a we…

As long as it works on a degoogled Android phone I'm fine with it. Maybe someone in the supported countries with an GraphenOS or /e/OS phone can confirm? Edit: for some banks it will just forward to the bank's app. So most likely it works as long as your bank supports degoogled Android, similar to how iDEAL + Tikkie works on degoogled Android with most Dutch banks.

I should've been clearer - by Google-approved, I meant that your device has to pass Google's remote attestation scheme. From https://support.wero-wallet.eu/hc/en-us/articles/25599098295...:

> I’m seeing this error message: "Your device does not meet our security requirements".

> /../ If the operating system is an Android variant (also called a 'custom ROM'), such as LineageOS or Pixel Experience, then the wero app can’t be installed for security reasons.

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#45

Post by [deleted] »

bahmboo wrote: post #26
mzajc wrote: post #7

From what I've gathered, they've decided to make this completely unusable without a Google- or Apple-approved smartphone. Horrible! Are individual banks even allowed to make that an option for clients? Though even if they are, I doubt any will. I would LOVE a PayPal alternative, but this is just not it. -- From https://support.wero-wallet.eu/hc/en-us/articles/25599074240... : > It is not possible to use Wero via a we…

That link is broken for me. I would like clarity if they support AOSP devices. That would be a meaningful departure from the status quo.

[deleted]

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#46

Post by zokier »

I think this press release adds much needed context: https://epicompany.eu/media-insights/bancomat-bizum-epi-sibs...

Especially these parts:

> The cooperation builds on the success of existing solutions, connecting them via a central hub to create a truly pan-European experience for cross-border payments.

> European consumers will continue using their current preferred solution, now with broader European reach

> The cooperation is based on a central interoperability hub, operated by a future central entity jointly established by the partners.

So it is unlikely that Wero will be the single solution for entire Europe. Instead it is one of many solutions that hopefully will interoperate in the future. But we are still in the MoU phase only, so lets see what happens...

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#47

Post by drnick1 »

cyberpunk wrote: post #35
mzajc wrote: post #7

From what I've gathered, they've decided to make this completely unusable without a Google- or Apple-approved smartphone. Horrible! Are individual banks even allowed to make that an option for clients? Though even if they are, I doubt any will. I would LOVE a PayPal alternative, but this is just not it. -- From https://support.wero-wallet.eu/hc/en-us/articles/25599074240... : > It is not possible to use Wero via a we…

This is a regulatory thing, devices used for instant payments should be somehow attested and be authenticated (or be a physical device the bank issued e.g your card). It’s a difficult thing, we don’t want to have to force smartphone choices but the number of users without one these devices is so vanishingly small it’s very difficult to change the legislation in order to support them too. I think the happy middle grou…

> we don’t want to have to force smartphone choices but the number of users without one these devices is so vanishingly small

You are missing the point. The issue is that once the "vanishingly small" number of alternatives disappears, users will be completely trapped, and Google and Apple will then free to abuse that position of power (they already do). Worse, since power is centralized, it is very easy for government interference to take place, and we already see that with things such as identity and age verification requirements. It is the possibility of competition that matters more than actual competition.

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#48

Post by cyberpunk »

linohh wrote: post #41
cyberpunk wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a regulatory thing, devices used for instant payments should be somehow attested and be authenticated (or be a physical device the bank issued e.g your card). It’s a difficult thing, we don’t want to have to force smartphone choices but the number of users without one these devices is so vanishingly small it’s very difficult to change the legislation in order to support them too. I think the happy middle grou…

I don't see, why a smartphone plus NFC enabled token device wouldn't work within the regulation, we should go that way, (or any way decoupling Google & Co. from it) because we should be prepared for US companies to be forced to act unreasonably by an unreasonable leader.

I agree, I’m not saying it’s totally correct or there aren’t answers, but those are the current rules at least in my bank.

Instant payments bypass typical surveillance and fraud systems and so need some kind of authentication, if you don’t want to 2fa every time you’re at the checkout then the application has to have been previously authenticated (e.g setup with some kinda TAN from your bank) and execute on an attested device. We can def extend attestation to other devices (e.g is the kernel modified, does the app have reasonable version and checksums etc) but again, who is gonna fund that for 10 users?

edit: We have a long road to go before this stuff gets better, I think we should be happy at each step instead of really wishing we were already at the finish.

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#49

Post by mzajc »

cyberpunk wrote: post #35
mzajc wrote: post #7

From what I've gathered, they've decided to make this completely unusable without a Google- or Apple-approved smartphone. Horrible! Are individual banks even allowed to make that an option for clients? Though even if they are, I doubt any will. I would LOVE a PayPal alternative, but this is just not it. -- From https://support.wero-wallet.eu/hc/en-us/articles/25599074240... : > It is not possible to use Wero via a we…

This is a regulatory thing, devices used for instant payments should be somehow attested and be authenticated (or be a physical device the bank issued e.g your card). It’s a difficult thing, we don’t want to have to force smartphone choices but the number of users without one these devices is so vanishingly small it’s very difficult to change the legislation in order to support them too. I think the happy middle grou…

Then I'll unfortunately have to continue paying the PayPal tax - apparently they have no issues running in any browser of my choice.

> I think the happy middle ground is making this system also work with bank issued cards.

That wouldn't let me pay online.

Re: Wero – Digital payment wallet, made in Europe

#50

Post by maelito »

mzajc wrote: post #7

From what I've gathered, they've decided to make this completely unusable without a Google- or Apple-approved smartphone. Horrible! Are individual banks even allowed to make that an option for clients? Though even if they are, I doubt any will. I would LOVE a PayPal alternative, but this is just not it. -- From https://support.wero-wallet.eu/hc/en-us/articles/25599074240... : > It is not possible to use Wero via a we…

I'm using my bank's app on a fully de-googlised Lineageos (no MicroG) and Wero works.

But with another bank, when I had to install the Wero app, it didn't work at all.

Post reply on HN