Earlier quoted context omitted.
Its being downvoted because HN has a very active billionaire-techbro-fanbase. Also who's this Dario?
It's being downvoted because it's a ridiculous premise. "The Elites" are human too. This attitude is nonsensical and child-like. Nobody is out here trying to round up the hippies and force them to live in some kind of pods to be harvested for their nutrients or whatever. This technology, like every prior technology, will cause some people to lose their jobs and some new jobs to be created. This will annoy people who…
GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
41–50 of 138 posts
Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#42Earlier quoted context omitted.
The proposed solution is also pretty confused: > For each response, the GenAI tool lists the sources from which it extracted that content, perhaps formatted as a list of links back to the content creators, sorted by relevance, similar to a search engine This literally isn’t possible given the architecture of transformer models and there’s no indication it will ever be.
Could you ELI5 why this isn't possible? Google's search result AI summary shows the links for example.
Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#43This is an article that I agreed with more reading the headline than I did when I finished reading the article itself. Stack Overflow peaked in 2014 before beginning it's downward decline. How is that at all related to GenAI? GPT4 is when we really started seeing these things get used to replace SO, etc., and that would be early 2023 - and indeed the drop gets worse there - but after the COVID era spike, SO was alrea…
I always found it very frustrating that for a person at the start of the learning curve it was "read only"
Actually asking a naive question there was to get horribly flamed on the site. It, and the people using it, were very keen to explain how stupid you were being
LLMs on the other hand are sweet and welcoming (to a fault) of the naive newbie
I have been learning to use Shell script with the help of LLMs, I could not achieve that using SO
Good riddance
Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's being downvoted because it's a ridiculous premise. "The Elites" are human too. This attitude is nonsensical and child-like. Nobody is out here trying to round up the hippies and force them to live in some kind of pods to be harvested for their nutrients or whatever. This technology, like every prior technology, will cause some people to lose their jobs and some new jobs to be created. This will annoy people who…
And just like Henry Ford and the automobile, one of many externalities was the destruction of black communities: white flight that drained wealth, eminent domain for highways, and increased asthma incidence and other disease from concentrated pollution.
Did you know the 2/3rds of the people alive today wouldn't be if it hadn't been for the invention of the Haber-bosch process? Technology isn't just a toy, it's our life support mechanism. The only way our population gets to keep growing is if our technology continues to improve.
Will there be some unintended consequences? Absolutely. Does that mean we can (or even should) stop it? Hell no. Being pro-human requires you to be pro-technology.
Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#45Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#46The ONLY reason we are here today is because OpenAI, and Anthropic, by extension, took it upon themselves to launch chat bots trained on whatever datasources they could get in a short amount of time to quickly productize their investments. Their first versions didn't include any references to the source material, and just acted as if they knew everything.
When CoPilot was built as a better auto-complete engine, trained on opensource projects, it was an interesting idea, because it doing what people already did. They searched GitHub for examples of the solution or nudged them in that direction. However, the biggest difference, using other project code was stable, because it came with a LICENSE.md that you then agreed to, and paid it forward. (i.e. "I used code from this project").
CoPilot initially would just inject snippets for you, without you knowing the source. It was only later, they walked that back and if you did use CoPilot, it shows you the most-likely source of the code it used. This is exactly the direction all of the platforms seem headed.
It's not easy to walk back the free-for-all system (i.e. Napster), but I'm optimistic over time it'll become a more fair, pay to access system.
Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#47Earlier quoted context omitted.
The proposed solution is also pretty confused: > For each response, the GenAI tool lists the sources from which it extracted that content, perhaps formatted as a list of links back to the content creators, sorted by relevance, similar to a search engine This literally isn’t possible given the architecture of transformer models and there’s no indication it will ever be.
Could you ELI5 why this isn't possible? Google's search result AI summary shows the links for example.
But even the part that is coming from the context is only being produced by the weights. As I said, every token is some mathematical combination of the weights and the context.
So it can produce text that does not correctly summarize the content in its context, on incorrectly reproduce the link, or incorrectly map the link to the part of its context that came from that link, or more generally just make shit up.
Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#48GenAI changes the dynamics of information systems so fundamentally that our entire notion of intellectual property is being upended. Copyright was predicated on the notion that ideas and styles can not be protected , but that explicit expressive works can. For example, a recipe can't be protected, but the story you wrap around it that tells how your grandma used to make it would be. LLMs are particularly challenging…
The ONLY things that matter when determining whether copyright was infringed are "access" and "substantial similarity". The first refers to whether the alleged infringer did, or had a reasonable opportunity to, view the copyrighted work. The second is more vague and open-ended. But if these two, alone, can be established in court, then absent a fair use or other defense (for example, all of the ways in which your work is "substantially similar" to the infringed work are public domain), you are infringing. Period. End of story.
The Tetris Company, for example, owns the idea of falling-tetromino puzzle video games. If you develop and release such a game, they will sue you and they will win. They have won in the past and they can retain Boies-tier lawyers to litigate a small crater where you once stood if need be. In fact, the ruling in the Tetris vs. Xio case means that look-and-feel copyrights, thought dead after Apple v. Microsoft and Lotus v. Borland, are now back on the table.
It's not like this is even terribly new. Atari, license holders to Pac-Man on game consoles at the time, sued Philips over the release of K.C. Munchkin! on their rival console, the Magnavox Odyssey 2. Munchkin didn't look like Pac-Man. The monsters didn't look like the ghosts from Pac-Man. The mazes and some of the game mechanics were significantly different. Yet, the judge ruled that because it featured an "eater" who ate dots and avoided enemies in a maze, and sometimes had the opportunity to eat the enemies, K.C. Munchkin! infringed on the copyrights to Pac-Man. The ideas used in Pac-Man were novel enough to be eligible for copyright protection.
Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#49I do not know what will replace it, but I will not miss websites trying to monetise my attention
Re: GenAI, the snake eating its own tail
#50Earlier quoted context omitted.
Its being downvoted because HN has a very active billionaire-techbro-fanbase. Also who's this Dario?
It's being downvoted because it's a ridiculous premise. "The Elites" are human too. This attitude is nonsensical and child-like. Nobody is out here trying to round up the hippies and force them to live in some kind of pods to be harvested for their nutrients or whatever. This technology, like every prior technology, will cause some people to lose their jobs and some new jobs to be created. This will annoy people who…