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Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

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Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#41

Post by justin66 »

AlotOfReading wrote: post #33
justin66 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What examples of digging through that amount of ice for the purposes of mining are you familiar with? What's a good example? It'd be interesting to understand how much the environment there increases the cost of mining. Anything is possible, but it'd be cool to know whether it makes any sense. (and yes, I think our leadership in the US is fully capable of causing an international crisis over mineral assets that would…

It's not for mining, but the US built Camp Century and Camp TUTO in the ice to determine how feasible Project Iceworm would be. A construction film about the former was declassified some decades ago [0]. Icefield construction wasn't feasible even in the context of cold-war era MAD spending. Actual subglacial mining has only been attempted a few times. Kumtor gold mine in Kyrgyzstan is in the middle of a couple glacie…

I guess I don't even know what to do with some of this information. It occurred to me that you'd also probably have to build some infrastructure (power plant, railroad, fuel terminal, a real port... I don't know) in order to even get the ball rolling. I don't think anyone's going to pay for that by taxing the citizens of Nuuk.

I also wonder if there has ever been a real geopolitical obstacle to doing this stuff, since the Danes and Greenlanders seem amenable to doing business. It would seem the obstacles have all been financial.

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#42

Post by [deleted] »

fasbiner wrote: post #40
thatguy0900 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I threatened someone until they sold me something that they made very clear they did not want to sell noone would call it "Buying" and we shouldn't either. It would be extorting. Under no circumstances are we buying Greenland at this point, anything that happens is something else.

Extortion is the right word here. The problem is that virtually the entire new world and much of the old world was acquired by force and threats of force that has been legitimized over time. So yes, I think this is clearly extortion and any sale that takes would be coerced. But ever was it thus.

[deleted]

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#43

Post by AlotOfReading »

justin66 wrote: post #41
AlotOfReading wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not for mining, but the US built Camp Century and Camp TUTO in the ice to determine how feasible Project Iceworm would be. A construction film about the former was declassified some decades ago [0]. Icefield construction wasn't feasible even in the context of cold-war era MAD spending. Actual subglacial mining has only been attempted a few times. Kumtor gold mine in Kyrgyzstan is in the middle of a couple glacie…

I guess I don't even know what to do with some of this information. It occurred to me that you'd also probably have to build some infrastructure (power plant, railroad, fuel terminal, a real port... I don't know) in order to even get the ball rolling. I don't think anyone's going to pay for that by taxing the citizens of Nuuk. I also wonder if there has ever been a real geopolitical obstacle to doing this stuff, sinc…

As I said in a comment elsewhere, arctic mining is doable with nation-state level resources. There's just no reason to do so that isn't better accomplished by other means. It would be stupid, expensive, and devastate a beautiful country.

As for "amenable", my experience is that people in the arctic are relatively unhappy about that sort of industrial development. They like the places they live.

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#44

Post by fifilura »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #38
fifilura wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ice comes from the side not from above.

And? So carve out a wider area. The defeatism is palpable in here, some hackers. Why even get out of bed in the morning, right? They extract oil from tar sands in Alberta, for example. Difficult things are done all the time that are costly, as long as the price exceeds the cost. To be clear my post above is not supportive of the administration, but rather the feasibility of mining at high latitudes.

Yeah if there were no other cheaper alternatives I am sure someone would find a way.

But it seems like a pretty long financial stretch to first pay for invading a country and then this.

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#45

Post by mixmastamyk »

fifilura wrote: post #44
mixmastamyk wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And? So carve out a wider area. The defeatism is palpable in here, some hackers. Why even get out of bed in the morning, right? They extract oil from tar sands in Alberta, for example. Difficult things are done all the time that are costly, as long as the price exceeds the cost. To be clear my post above is not supportive of the administration, but rather the feasibility of mining at high latitudes.

Yeah if there were no other cheaper alternatives I am sure someone would find a way. But it seems like a pretty long financial stretch to first pay for invading a country and then this.

Greenland is 99% uninhabited. There is no significant bill for invasion beyond transportation of mining equipment, cheap at sea. They were talking about buying it or the inhabitants, but that is paid with other people's money.

Reply below: It's been under Danish control, and the Arctic is warming more quickly than other parts of the world.

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#46

Post by fifilura »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #45
fifilura wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah if there were no other cheaper alternatives I am sure someone would find a way. But it seems like a pretty long financial stretch to first pay for invading a country and then this.

Greenland is 99% uninhabited. There is no significant bill for invasion beyond transportation of mining equipment, cheap at sea. They were talking about buying it or the inhabitants, but that is paid with other people's money. Reply below: It's been under Danish control, and the Arctic is warming more quickly than other parts of the world.

I assume it has not happened because there are better things to bet your money on.

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#47

Post by thatguy0900 »

fasbiner wrote: post #40
thatguy0900 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I threatened someone until they sold me something that they made very clear they did not want to sell noone would call it "Buying" and we shouldn't either. It would be extorting. Under no circumstances are we buying Greenland at this point, anything that happens is something else.

Extortion is the right word here. The problem is that virtually the entire new world and much of the old world was acquired by force and threats of force that has been legitimized over time. So yes, I think this is clearly extortion and any sale that takes would be coerced. But ever was it thus.

For sure in the future I'm sure the US will teach that it was a fair deal and nato was corrupt anyway but I hate to see the whitewashing of it going on already like it's a casual land purchase offer

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#48

Post by [deleted] »

troyvit wrote: post #16
david-gpu wrote: post #4

I hope we can at least avoid the sanewashing. > President Donald Trump has renewed his efforts to take over Greenland, and tapping into the Danish territory’s natural resources is a key part of the strategy. It is not "taking over" or "annexing" . It is invading . A military ally , at that. And it is not "tapping into [...] natural resources" . It is plundering their natural resources . None of these hypotheticals ar…

While we're at it I also fail to see any strategy.

[deleted]

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#49

Post by prepend »

thatguy0900 wrote: post #37
prepend wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not invading, yet. Just buying or psyopping is more likely than fighting NATO.

If I threatened someone until they sold me something that they made very clear they did not want to sell noone would call it "Buying" and we shouldn't either. It would be extorting. Under no circumstances are we buying Greenland at this point, anything that happens is something else.

Extorting is more accurate. But definitely not invading.

Re: Why Greenland's natural resources are nearly impossible to mine

#50

Post by prepend »

dukeyukey wrote: post #15
prepend wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s definitely easier to mine in Australia. But you can do both. It’s about marginal profitability, not absolute. Do people think we must pick just one place to mine?

You can do both, but why would you? It's not like we've tapped out Australia. And until we have, why bother with Greenland if the same money invested in Australia, or Sweden, or Canada would yield more profit?

You’d do both because up can. Why mine in Australia when you have the US or Canada, etc etc.

The idea would mine in all places where it’s marginally profitable until your capital is fully committed.

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