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What *is* code? (2015)

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Re: What *is* code? (2015)

#41

Post by EvanAnderson »

wavemode wrote: post #36
bossyTeacher wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure what country you live in, but where I live, a receptionist doesn't have access to any data processing tools that are not within the realm of a receptionist, and therefore this mobility does not happen. The receptionist ends up redirect the query to someone who has access to the relevant systems. What sort of companies are those were receptionists have access to tools beyond their role? and why are people app…

You're still thinking too much in a "tech company" mindset. At the kind of company I'm talking about, concepts like "access" and "permissions" are irrelevant. Most of the company's employees barely know how a computer works. You seemed vaguely tech savvy, so someone asked you for help and emailed you a file containing the data (or perhaps just handed you a laptop and turned you loose). The rest is history. It's a mod…

> You seemed vaguely tech savvy, so someone asked you for help and emailed you a file containing the data (or perhaps just handed you a laptop and turned you loose). The rest is history.

I know that someday I'll work in something other than IT. When I do I am going to make for damned sure that I don't express even the slightest bit of tech savvy for exactly this reason.

It's similar to playing dumb w/ people I encounter outside work who find out I work in IT. If I get asked a question I play dumb and cop to working on some highly siloed subject (usually I'll claim to only work on "networking" or firewalls... >smile<).

Re: What *is* code? (2015)

#42

Post by Groxx »

layer8 wrote: post #37
shawnz wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to think this, until I tried it. Now I see that it effectively removes all the tedium while still letting you have whatever level of creative control you want over the output. Just imagine that instead of having to work off of an amorphous draft in your head, it really creates the draft right in front of you in actual code. You can still shape and craft and refine it just the same, but now you have tons more w…

I’m getting the impression that developers vary substantially in what they consider tedium, or meaningful.

Shockingly, software developers are people, and are as varied as people are elsewhere. Particularly since it became (relatively) mainstream.

Re: What *is* code? (2015)

#43

Post by stonemetal12 »

bossyTeacher wrote: post #28
wavemode wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is a gap between receptionist and official software engineer. At many companies (especially old, stodgy companies) this gap is artificial. The day you get asked "hey, I've got some data .... and I need ..." and you successfully solve the person's problem, is the day you become the office's live-in software engineer. That person you helped will be back, and they will bring friends. The rest after that is just…

Not sure what country you live in, but where I live, a receptionist doesn't have access to any data processing tools that are not within the realm of a receptionist, and therefore this mobility does not happen. The receptionist ends up redirect the query to someone who has access to the relevant systems. What sort of companies are those were receptionists have access to tools beyond their role? and why are people app…

>receptionist answering phones and scanning paper records in

They were also converting paper records to digital. Asking the data entry person where the data is or how to find paper record xyz in the digital system doesn't seem odd.

Re: What *is* code? (2015)

#44

Post by inopinatus »

bossyTeacher wrote: post #28
wavemode wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is a gap between receptionist and official software engineer. At many companies (especially old, stodgy companies) this gap is artificial. The day you get asked "hey, I've got some data .... and I need ..." and you successfully solve the person's problem, is the day you become the office's live-in software engineer. That person you helped will be back, and they will bring friends. The rest after that is just…

Not sure what country you live in, but where I live, a receptionist doesn't have access to any data processing tools that are not within the realm of a receptionist, and therefore this mobility does not happen. The receptionist ends up redirect the query to someone who has access to the relevant systems. What sort of companies are those were receptionists have access to tools beyond their role? and why are people app…

Microsoft Excel is the #1 tool at the top of that rather narrowly envisioned slippery slope, since you ask. Followed by any web browser.

As for data access; the vast majority of firms, worldwide, in every country, have abysmal internal controls, and in many cases, none at all. The filing cabinet is unlocked all day, everything from payroll to posters is in a share that every network login can R/W, and nobody cares.

Re: What *is* code? (2015)

#47

Post by 0xdeadbeefbabe »

dghlsakjg wrote: post #39
bossyTeacher wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure what country you live in, but where I live, a receptionist doesn't have access to any data processing tools that are not within the realm of a receptionist, and therefore this mobility does not happen. The receptionist ends up redirect the query to someone who has access to the relevant systems. What sort of companies are those were receptionists have access to tools beyond their role? and why are people app…

Many small business. The first job I had where I did anything technical (basic JS and HTML) also had me cold calling, answering phones, designing brochures, fiberglass repair, and some other stuff I’m forgetting. Small businesses frequently have more niche jobs than people and are more than happy to have people help where they are interested. My first full software job was a direct to consumer company, and during the…

In small companies there is one lane.

Re: What *is* code? (2015)

#48

Post by stevenhuang »

throw0101d wrote: post #30

One answer to the question, from Bryan Cantrill: > The thing that is remarkable about it is that it has this property of being information—that we made it up—but it is also machine, and it has these engineered properties. And this is where software is unlikely anything we have ever done, and we're still grappling on that that means. What does it mean to have information that functions as machine? It's got this dualit…

There's a similar article I read on this in regards to intelligence and LLMs that says simulated intelligence _is_ intelligence.

Re: What *is* code? (2015)

#49

Post by dghlsakjg »

0xdeadbeefbabe wrote: post #47
dghlsakjg wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many small business. The first job I had where I did anything technical (basic JS and HTML) also had me cold calling, answering phones, designing brochures, fiberglass repair, and some other stuff I’m forgetting. Small businesses frequently have more niche jobs than people and are more than happy to have people help where they are interested. My first full software job was a direct to consumer company, and during the…

In small companies there is one lane.

Which lane was I in?

Re: What *is* code? (2015)

#50

Post by hnfong »

stevenhuang wrote: post #48
throw0101d wrote: post #30

One answer to the question, from Bryan Cantrill: > The thing that is remarkable about it is that it has this property of being information—that we made it up—but it is also machine, and it has these engineered properties. And this is where software is unlikely anything we have ever done, and we're still grappling on that that means. What does it mean to have information that functions as machine? It's got this dualit…

There's a similar article I read on this in regards to intelligence and LLMs that says simulated intelligence _is_ intelligence.

Interesting. Do you have the link?

I'm kinda interested in the subject (see eg. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46247266 )

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