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Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

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Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#41

Post by andreasvc »

kokey wrote: post #35
steve8918 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I 100% agree. Actually I have done almost exactly that, switched to tea, or ice tea. I'm not completely off the sugary drinks, but I'll drink things like Honest Tea with a lot less sugar than Coke, or just plain Tea. The thing I'm actually most worried about is pancreatic cancer. I'm not even sure if there's a link between that and soft drinks, but I read one study where having 2-3 soft drinks a week doubled your ris…

For sweetness, try rotating between non-fructuse sweeteners. like saccharin, aspartame, stevia, etc. I also find that Coke Zero is a nice way to cut down on sugar but still keep the Coke taste, and it's a lot less acidic than Diet Coke. However I don't find vending machines stocking it as often as I'd like. That's assuming you are not buying into the aspartame myths. I've got diabetes in my family, so to me the risks…

In terms of acidity it's the other way around. From the article:

"say you have two liquids, like Diet Coke and Coke Zero. Diet Coke has a pH of 4. Coke Zero has a pH of 3. Since pH measurements are logarithmic, this means that Coke Zero is ten times more acidic than Diet Coke."

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#42

Post by tocomment »

artemus wrote: post #39
tocomment wrote: post #36

I've never understood if sugar affects gum disease. Does anyone know? Does the gum disease bacteria eat sugar or directly eat your teeth and gums? I tried looking it up once but I only found information about sugar and cavities.

Bacteria consume sugar, which produces acid as a waste-product, which erodes enamel. Gum disease is primarily an inflammatory response to the presence of external irritants like dental plaque (which contains bacteria as well).

So there's no specific gum disease bacteria? It's just the same bacteria that causes cavities?

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#43

Post by iopuy »

kokey wrote: post #35
steve8918 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I 100% agree. Actually I have done almost exactly that, switched to tea, or ice tea. I'm not completely off the sugary drinks, but I'll drink things like Honest Tea with a lot less sugar than Coke, or just plain Tea. The thing I'm actually most worried about is pancreatic cancer. I'm not even sure if there's a link between that and soft drinks, but I read one study where having 2-3 soft drinks a week doubled your ris…

For sweetness, try rotating between non-fructuse sweeteners. like saccharin, aspartame, stevia, etc. I also find that Coke Zero is a nice way to cut down on sugar but still keep the Coke taste, and it's a lot less acidic than Diet Coke. However I don't find vending machines stocking it as often as I'd like. That's assuming you are not buying into the aspartame myths. I've got diabetes in my family, so to me the risks…

Did you read the article? Coke zero is ten times more acidic than diet coke.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#44

Post by artemus »

tocomment wrote: post #42
artemus wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bacteria consume sugar, which produces acid as a waste-product, which erodes enamel. Gum disease is primarily an inflammatory response to the presence of external irritants like dental plaque (which contains bacteria as well).

So there's no specific gum disease bacteria? It's just the same bacteria that causes cavities?

According to Feng & Weinberg:

Approximately 500 bacterial species reside in the oral cavity. Of these, 415 species are estimated to be present in subgingival plaque. Specifically:

"A. actinomycetemcomitans has been strongly implicated in localized aggressive (juvenile) periodontitis Likewise, bacteria such as P. gingivalis, A. actinomycetemcomitans, Tannerella forsythia (formerly, Bacteroides forsythus), Treponema denticola, and Eikenella corrodens have been associated with chronic (adult) periodontitis."

Ref: http://www.perioimplantelsalvador.com/Informacion/bibliograf...

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#45

Post by nathanb »

deltaqueue wrote: post #28

I wish he would have provided more explanation behind the dentist's algorithm. Here's an actual study measuring enamel loss, which seems much more definitive: http://faculty.philau.edu/ashleyj/General%20Dentistry%20Arti... Perhaps the most important snippet: Regression analysis indicated no correlation between enamel dissolution and beverage pH (r = 0.477, p > 0.05); in addition, the enamel dissolution showed no diff…

Or how about experimental science? Get some human teeth (probably not difficult or expensive for a dentist), weigh them, plunk them in each liquid, let them sit for a week, see which ones lost the most mass.

Obviously scientific rigor would require several experiments to smooth out the variances in individual tooth quality and original composition, but it seems like that would come to a more definitive conclusion.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#47

Post by steve8918 »

kokey wrote: post #35
steve8918 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I 100% agree. Actually I have done almost exactly that, switched to tea, or ice tea. I'm not completely off the sugary drinks, but I'll drink things like Honest Tea with a lot less sugar than Coke, or just plain Tea. The thing I'm actually most worried about is pancreatic cancer. I'm not even sure if there's a link between that and soft drinks, but I read one study where having 2-3 soft drinks a week doubled your ris…

For sweetness, try rotating between non-fructuse sweeteners. like saccharin, aspartame, stevia, etc. I also find that Coke Zero is a nice way to cut down on sugar but still keep the Coke taste, and it's a lot less acidic than Diet Coke. However I don't find vending machines stocking it as often as I'd like. That's assuming you are not buying into the aspartame myths. I've got diabetes in my family, so to me the risks…

Actually I can't eat aspartame because it severely upsets my stomach, so I need to avoid it completely. Even things like chewing gum with aspartame cause my stomach to get really upset. I think the best solution is simply not eat as much sugar as possible. I was on South Beach diet several years ago, and I actually lost 20 lbs in 5 months, so maybe I will do something similar.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#48

Post by napillo »

nathanb wrote: post #45
deltaqueue wrote: post #28

I wish he would have provided more explanation behind the dentist's algorithm. Here's an actual study measuring enamel loss, which seems much more definitive: http://faculty.philau.edu/ashleyj/General%20Dentistry%20Arti... Perhaps the most important snippet: Regression analysis indicated no correlation between enamel dissolution and beverage pH (r = 0.477, p > 0.05); in addition, the enamel dissolution showed no diff…

Or how about experimental science? Get some human teeth (probably not difficult or expensive for a dentist), weigh them, plunk them in each liquid, let them sit for a week, see which ones lost the most mass. Obviously scientific rigor would require several experiments to smooth out the variances in individual tooth quality and original composition, but it seems like that would come to a more definitive conclusion.

Did you RTFA? That's what they did.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#49

Post by splat »

nathanb wrote: post #45
deltaqueue wrote: post #28

I wish he would have provided more explanation behind the dentist's algorithm. Here's an actual study measuring enamel loss, which seems much more definitive: http://faculty.philau.edu/ashleyj/General%20Dentistry%20Arti... Perhaps the most important snippet: Regression analysis indicated no correlation between enamel dissolution and beverage pH (r = 0.477, p > 0.05); in addition, the enamel dissolution showed no diff…

Or how about experimental science? Get some human teeth (probably not difficult or expensive for a dentist), weigh them, plunk them in each liquid, let them sit for a week, see which ones lost the most mass. Obviously scientific rigor would require several experiments to smooth out the variances in individual tooth quality and original composition, but it seems like that would come to a more definitive conclusion.

I think the presence of saliva has a major effect on inhibiting tooth decay. I'm not sure how applicable in vitro experiments would be.

Re: Sugar, acid and teeth (2009)

#50

Post by JabavuAdams »

scott_s wrote: post #19
skylan_q wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the dentist is being scientific, it's up to him to back up his claims about sugar and acid being the most (or only) important indicators for what's bad for teeth. EDIT: For example, there's been some interesting work discussed here: http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.ca/2009/03/reversing-tooth...

If you do some googling, it's commonly accepted that both sugar and acid are bad for your teeth, with plenty of justification. Some of the reasons are even covered in the article. You're correct in that their classification of "worst" only applies if sugar and acidity are the most important factors. But they're clearly a large factor in tooth decay, so measuring the contents of various liquids and comparing them to e…

> But they're clearly a large factor in tooth decay

Maybe, maybe not. The in-vivo environment might have many significant differences than some in-vitro setup. What's the role of saliva? of bacteria? of genetics?

Don't underestimate the power of the telephone game (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_whispers). You need to go back to primary sources. It's very common for papers in software engineering, for instance, to confuse qualitative statements from earlier papers with empirical results.

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