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Building a macOS app to know when my Mac is thermal throttling

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Re: Building a macOS app to know when my Mac is thermal throttling

#41

Post by embedding-shape »

Forgeties79 wrote: post #35
embedding-shape wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "set fan to speed needed for temp z"(pid control) Why though? I generally don't care about the specific temperatures of my CPU and GPU, just that they don't get too warm, so for the CPU (AIO) I basically have "0% up until 45C, then increment up to 100% when it hits 90C" and the same for the GPU except it's always at 10%. I guess I could figure out target temperatures, and do it the other way, but I'm not sure what…

This could be total nonsense and I am definitely out on a limb here, but I remember from my amateur crypto mining days (almost 15 years ago wow) that keeping everything relatively consistent is better for the longevity of your hardware (GPU/CPU mainly). Some people obsessed over getting temps as low as possible but that’s not very productive, diminishing returns and all of that. There is just generally a healthy temp…

> Basically: swinging/fluctuating is not good, consistency is good.

Yeah, I'd understand not wanting to go between 0C and 90C over and over. But my GPU idles at around 35C, maxes out at 85C or something, and going back and fourth will surely be preferable than staying with a single temperature but voltage clock the card. Especially considering performance.

But again, I'm using my card for ML, number-crunching, simulations and VFX, you might be right that the use case of cryptocurrency mining prefers a different thermal profile.

Re: Building a macOS app to know when my Mac is thermal throttling

#42

Post by The_President »

Forgeties79 wrote: post #35
embedding-shape wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "set fan to speed needed for temp z"(pid control) Why though? I generally don't care about the specific temperatures of my CPU and GPU, just that they don't get too warm, so for the CPU (AIO) I basically have "0% up until 45C, then increment up to 100% when it hits 90C" and the same for the GPU except it's always at 10%. I guess I could figure out target temperatures, and do it the other way, but I'm not sure what…

This could be total nonsense and I am definitely out on a limb here, but I remember from my amateur crypto mining days (almost 15 years ago wow) that keeping everything relatively consistent is better for the longevity of your hardware (GPU/CPU mainly). Some people obsessed over getting temps as low as possible but that’s not very productive, diminishing returns and all of that. There is just generally a healthy temp…

You're speaking the truth, as this is not nonsense - it is correct. At the micro level, thermal expansion/contracting is occurring across the variety of the circuit board materials and components. Hot is fine (not too hot), but it is the consistency that makes for longetivity.

I limit power consumption profiles and clock speeds unless higher power is required, and combine that with an oversized cooling system - keeps regular temps consistent.

Re: Building a macOS app to know when my Mac is thermal throttling

#44

Post by Espressosaurus »

kec wrote: post #38
somat wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An open question on fan curves Environment: I am currently playing with a pid control function for my gpu fan, that is instead of saying "map temp x to fanspeed y"(fan curve) say "set fan to speed needed for temp z"(pid control) Question: is there a reason pid type control is never a thermal option? Or put another way, is there something about the desired thermal characteristics of a computer that make pid control un…

PID loops work best when you have active control for both heating and cooling. PIDs are also best when you have a single optimal point you’re aiming at, there’s a kind of fundamental mismatch here in that there isn’t really a “too cold” for your system, you’re just aiming to keep the system below an upper limit while hopefully keeping fan noise to a minimum (otherwise you’d just send it and run at max 24/7).

A simple PID wants to keep it at a setpoint, but it’s easy enough to layer a target change on top of it, some hysteresis so it’s not pulsing on and off, perhaps with control authority depending on the the target, etc. but then that gets complicated and usually manufacturers aren’t going to expose those sorts of tunings to the user.

For most people a fan curve is more obvious to work with and it’s largely good enough without the irritating behaviors insufficiently tuned control loops can exhibit.

Re: Building a macOS app to know when my Mac is thermal throttling

#46

Post by ChadNauseam »

widhhddok wrote: post #45
edwardtay wrote: post #32

[flagged]

The account that posted this comment seems to be a bot account - and one that doesn't even read the article in it's context.

One thing that annoys me about LLMs is how they say stuff that's dumb but sounds smart. For example:

> Have you considered adding historical tracking/graphing? Being able to see throttling patterns over time would be super valuable for understanding workload impacts and diagnosing thermal issues

Would it actually though? Is anyone going to ever check if their laptop was throttling at 6pm yesterday evening and then remember what they were found at that time and try to "understand workload impacts"? It's the type of thing that might come in kinda useful once in a while, not "super valuable". Idk, I notice this trend with LLMs a lot. Often what they say just doesn't really make sense when you think about it.

Re: Building a macOS app to know when my Mac is thermal throttling

#48

Post by angristan »

widhhddok wrote: post #45
edwardtay wrote: post #32

[flagged]

The account that posted this comment seems to be a bot account - and one that doesn't even read the article in it's context.

Agreed, half of these questions are answered in the post. Also, looking at the account's comment history confirms that it's karma-farming with comments or something like that

Re: Building a macOS app to know when my Mac is thermal throttling

#50

Post by Arn_Thor »

the_black_hand wrote: post #30

My 2017 macbook is basically brick. Crazy how just opening chrome sets off fans like a jet engine. How much cpu can checking gmail really use? Foolish me is considering buying a new macbook this year. I have no choice because Apple and Microsoft will do everything in their power to ship the shittiest personal computing products every year.

I'm sorry you're saddled with an Intel Mac. The Apple Silicon Macs really changed everything. Clearly Apple is capable and willing of shipping extremely good and performant hardware, even though historically they haven't always done so. I do blame Intel for their monopoly on mediocraty for the late-10s Macbooks though.
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