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Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

nikolaihlebowitsh.substack.com

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Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#41

Post by mothballed »

MichaelZuo wrote: post #36
brudgers wrote: post #9

Plumbing, HVAC and other skilled trades operate almost entirely B2B, not B2C. The very premise of this article is why that is the case...people who don't understand what is required, what is good, and how construction operates shopping solely on price with unreasonable expectations. That $22k quote? That's how a company can pay for capacity during peak demand...i.e. paying skilled workers enough to make extra long ho…

So then where are the premium HVAC companies for the residential market charging a higher price but offering credible guarantees?

Best I can do is $1000 to change a capacitor that any tom dick or harry could do, and $10,000 to install a mini split that I literally did myself for $1000 in tools and watching 8 hours of youtube.

The industry is largely a scam. There is no reason why you need a brick and mortar fixed business for many HVAC tasks. On one occasion, I knew exactly what was wrong but as a tenant so I could not perform the work myself. I had to deduct $1000 rent from my landlord becaues I had to pay an HVAC guy so I would not break the law literally replacing a plug-and-play blower motor myself. The guy didn't diagnose anything, or need any skill, I just told him exactly what to do and he was in and out in like 5 minutes.

Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#42

Post by mothballed »

amluto wrote: post #28

> An Uber-like, magical experience that you can trust to show up on time, do the right thing on your behalf, and fractionalize prices in an antiquated industry. I can summon an Uber and, by magic, I have a rather high chance of getting a distracted driver in a run-down car with a bunch of nasty air fresheners If Uber does this to me, I will still probably be unharmed at the end of the ride and I’m done which it. If a…

IF your Uber driver crashes in a bad way you'll be dead.

Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#43

Post by bluGill »

srmatto wrote: post #12

I can't comment on this idea but I will say that I would have expected press fittings to have brought down the cost of plumbing because they don't require soldering up to certain diameter. But they don't seem to have had any impact on the cost of plumbing despite not requiring as much skill. https://www.ferguson.com/content/ideas-and-learning-center/t...

Press fittings have a well earned reputation of leaking after a few years (they mostly rely on rubber o-rings that will dry out over a decade). They are rarely used by anyone who knows what they are doing.

Note that crimp fitters (which your link discourages!) do not have the same problem and are what most are moving too. Soldering still has a place, but is rarely used because modern PEX is so much cheaper and easier to work with.

Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#44

Post by vkou »

MichaelZuo wrote: post #36
brudgers wrote: post #9

Plumbing, HVAC and other skilled trades operate almost entirely B2B, not B2C. The very premise of this article is why that is the case...people who don't understand what is required, what is good, and how construction operates shopping solely on price with unreasonable expectations. That $22k quote? That's how a company can pay for capacity during peak demand...i.e. paying skilled workers enough to make extra long ho…

So then where are the premium HVAC companies for the residential market charging a higher price but offering credible guarantees?

Go with a good vendor and you won't have a problem.

The problem is, of course, that both good and bad vendors will charge similar amounts.

Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#45

Post by doctoring »

gruez wrote: post #40
brudgers wrote: post #9

Plumbing, HVAC and other skilled trades operate almost entirely B2B, not B2C. The very premise of this article is why that is the case...people who don't understand what is required, what is good, and how construction operates shopping solely on price with unreasonable expectations. That $22k quote? That's how a company can pay for capacity during peak demand...i.e. paying skilled workers enough to make extra long ho…

>In the world where people have reasonable options, relationships matter and relationships are non-fungible. What type of homeowner hires their plumber/HVAC guy based on "relationships"? They might only need a visit only once in a few years, so the idea of "relationships" is laughable.

I mean, I do? As do most of my friends who are homeowners. We are constantly asking each other for recommendations for people who can do X.

Hire a couple of disasters, and you will appreciate that a good relationship with a good contractor/tradesperson is worth an incredible amount of money (and time).

Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#46

Post by verall »

gruez wrote: post #40
brudgers wrote: post #9

Plumbing, HVAC and other skilled trades operate almost entirely B2B, not B2C. The very premise of this article is why that is the case...people who don't understand what is required, what is good, and how construction operates shopping solely on price with unreasonable expectations. That $22k quote? That's how a company can pay for capacity during peak demand...i.e. paying skilled workers enough to make extra long ho…

>In the world where people have reasonable options, relationships matter and relationships are non-fungible. What type of homeowner hires their plumber/HVAC guy based on "relationships"? They might only need a visit only once in a few years, so the idea of "relationships" is laughable.

I think this is how most homeowners hire this type of people, they either "have a guy" or they ask their friends/neighbors if they "have a guy". I have an HVAC guy who is miles better than the HVAC company with ~50 techs that I had come out before I found him. But if I needed some plumbing work done, I'd ask my neighbors, since I've never gotten plumbing done before.

If neither of these they fall back to advertising, door-to-door sales, classifieds, google reviews.

Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#48

Post by bluGill »

efields wrote: post #38
ekropotin wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which are 100% scam

That depends. We got one paid for by the seller of our house and in the first year it paid for an HVAC repair and plumber. I renewed it once for $600/year and wound up getting our refrigerator replaced in-kind, probably a $1500-2000 machine. I decided my luck had run out and so I _did not_ renew it again, and we haven't had any other issues that _would have been covered_ since then, so I think I played my cards right…

Problem is most of them are paid for by the seller who doesn't care about customer service. If your HVAC really was bad they will replace it when they must, but their incentive is to do the cheap repairs as long as possible, instead of the expensive do it right: hoping that eventually you give up and replace it yourself.

If people regularly paid for the yearly subscription they would have incentive to service the customer, but this would increase their costs and most people are not willing to pay the true yearly costs.

Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#49

Post by mothballed »

brudgers wrote: post #26
sharts wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just like you have many taco places on UberEATS/doordash, you could have many plumbing/HVAC companies to chose from along with common tasks, etc.

Uber Eats does not have to deal with past taco installations. HVAC repair does.

Honestly if you use greer or some budget-tier mini splits it's easier just to install a new one every time than to fix them. It would work for 99% of residential cases and be cheaper.

A lot of the 'real' HVAC companies will basically push you to buy new shit if anything is broken anyways, so may as well use that model in a way that's actually economically efficient and just have teams of essentially unskilled unlicensed "Uber" goons that only know how to install a brand new X brand mini split and that's the way they fix literally everything.

Re: Why is there no Uber for plumbing/HVAC? (and why there ought to be)

#50

Post by bluGill »

turnsout wrote: post #27

Uber and Lyft basically destroyed the taxi industry by subsidizing incredibly cheap rides until they had wiped out independent drivers, then gradually raised their prices much higher than taxis ever were. If there was an Uber for plumbing/HVAC, you would get ONE quote, and it would be higher than any of the ones you got. So I'm not sure that's the future we should be racing toward.

There are lots of HVAC companies trying the above in every city. Finding the good (often independent) tech is hard because they don't have the big ads.
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