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Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

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Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#41

Post by Retric »

almostgotcaught wrote: post #40
Retric wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An apples to apples comparison adjusted for things like Americans who have English as a second language or other countries removing people from school roles significantly shrinks the differences. A surprising number of the absolute best schools in the world by those same criteria are US public schools due to the population and resources going to those schools. So the issues are not quite so simple as they might first…

> An apples to apples comparison adjusted for things like Americans who have English as a second language or other countries removing people from school roles significantly shrinks the differences. "If I remove all the data that hurts my case, the data clearly supports my case!". Those people that you want to exclude aren't transients - they're either current or future Americans which are called immigrants . So if yo…

The point isn’t excluding buckets, the point is to have multiple points of comparison.

If we want to know which system you should copy, you want understand the factors that make that system more challenging. America doesn’t need to deal with severe malnutrition, but we may want to copy elements from countries dealing with such issues.

Unless of course the goal is a hit piece for whatever emotionally agenda you you’re pushing.

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#42

Post by egl2020 »

PoorRustDev wrote: post #33

I went to a DOD school for most (around 90%) of my life before High School, I'm happy to answer any questions as a student that actually attended elementary school on base in a foreign country. In general I would disagree with the posts that say they are not more discipline focused. It was a normal school, however if you were consistently a problem in class the squadron commander would be notified of a subordinates u…

"No one cared who your parents were." Did it never matter if my dad was a pfc and yours was the base commander? Ideally it shouldn't matter,but in practice?

Genuinely curious.

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#43

Post by almostgotcaught »

Retric wrote: post #41
almostgotcaught wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> An apples to apples comparison adjusted for things like Americans who have English as a second language or other countries removing people from school roles significantly shrinks the differences. "If I remove all the data that hurts my case, the data clearly supports my case!". Those people that you want to exclude aren't transients - they're either current or future Americans which are called immigrants . So if yo…

The point isn’t excluding buckets, the point is to have multiple points of comparison. If we want to know which system you should copy, you want understand the factors that make that system more challenging. America doesn’t need to deal with severe malnutrition, but we may want to copy elements from countries dealing with such issues. Unless of course the goal is a hit piece for whatever emotionally agenda you you’re…

I have no idea what this comment means.

I'm pointing out that "an apples to apples" comparison is all of the people in the seats at the schools because all of those people live, work, and (eventually) vote in your country.

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#44

Post by Retric »

almostgotcaught wrote: post #43
Retric wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point isn’t excluding buckets, the point is to have multiple points of comparison. If we want to know which system you should copy, you want understand the factors that make that system more challenging. America doesn’t need to deal with severe malnutrition, but we may want to copy elements from countries dealing with such issues. Unless of course the goal is a hit piece for whatever emotionally agenda you you’re…

I have no idea what this comment means. I'm pointing out that "an apples to apples" comparison is all of the people in the seats at the schools because all of those people live, work, and (eventually) vote in your country.

I edited for clarity, but an apples to apples comparison means to compare like to like not to compare everything.

I can weigh a bag of groceries, that’s a metric I can collect on everything you’re buying but it doesn’t tell me if you’re making healthy choices at the grocery store.

Similarly I can look at the test grades of everyone in Ukraine right now, but that tells me more about society in general than the countries school system.

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#45

Post by almostgotcaught »

Retric wrote: post #44
almostgotcaught wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea what this comment means. I'm pointing out that "an apples to apples" comparison is all of the people in the seats at the schools because all of those people live, work, and (eventually) vote in your country.

I edited for clarity, but an apples to apples comparison means to compare like to like not to compare everything. I can weigh a bag of groceries, that’s a metric I can collect on everything you’re buying but it doesn’t tell me if you’re making healthy choices at the grocery store. Similarly I can look at the test grades of everyone in Ukraine right now, but that tells me more about society in general than the countri…

> Similarly I can look at the test grades of everyone in Ukraine right now, but that tells me more about society in general than the countries school system.

I'll repeat for the third and final time: excluding people that speak English as a second language in a country's school system that has been taking immigrants for all time (and vaguely plans to continue) is not the same thing as excluding people affected by a brutal but eventually ending war.

I can't make it any simpler for you.

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#46

Post by Retric »

almostgotcaught wrote: post #45
Retric wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I edited for clarity, but an apples to apples comparison means to compare like to like not to compare everything. I can weigh a bag of groceries, that’s a metric I can collect on everything you’re buying but it doesn’t tell me if you’re making healthy choices at the grocery store. Similarly I can look at the test grades of everyone in Ukraine right now, but that tells me more about society in general than the countri…

> Similarly I can look at the test grades of everyone in Ukraine right now, but that tells me more about society in general than the countries school system. I'll repeat for the third and final time: excluding people that speak English as a second language in a country's school system that has been taking immigrants for all time (and vaguely plans to continue) is not the same thing as excluding people affected by a b…

> excluding people affected by a brutal but eventually ending war.

You just excluded people from these comparisons based on some goal.

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#47

Post by almostgotcaught »

Retric wrote: post #46
almostgotcaught wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Similarly I can look at the test grades of everyone in Ukraine right now, but that tells me more about society in general than the countries school system. I'll repeat for the third and final time: excluding people that speak English as a second language in a country's school system that has been taking immigrants for all time (and vaguely plans to continue) is not the same thing as excluding people affected by a b…

> excluding people affected by a brutal but eventually ending war. You just excluded people from these comparisons based on some goal.

If a concept has been made as simple as possible and it's still not simple enough for you to understand, then I'm sorry but I think this conversation is not for you.

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#48

Post by rickydroll »

moi2388 wrote: post #25
Waterluvian wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not sure this “thinking” on public education holds up if you look outside the U.S. where countries with emphasis on public education so consistently outperform the Americans. I guess at best it might be that there’s problems unique to American culture that makes public education not work. But that feels unlikely to hold up. I think the premise is simply wrong.

Well, my country has public schools, but children are segregated by educational prowess. The smartest kids go to schools which are completely separate from the less intelligent ones. If you fail, you might get sent to a lower school system. So this would explain why these disruptions would not appear in my country (or to a far lower degree)but would in the US school system.

How would your country school system deal with kids like me, ADHD with spots of brilliance and spots of, "how do you remember to breathe?"

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#49

Post by whimsicalism »

duskwuff wrote: post #13
thaumasiotes wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The military imposes strict IQ thresholds on those seeking to join. That's the point of the Armed Forces Qualifying Test.

DoDEA teaches the children of military families, not the enlisted themselves.

you seem to have taught yourself explicitly incorrect intuitions about how the world works, why? the vast majority of people know that kids resemble parents, it seems extreme to believe otherwise.

Re: Why The Pentagon run the best schools and the safest nuclear program

#50

Post by whimsicalism »

Waterluvian wrote: post #21
somenameforme wrote: post #9

This seems like a clear selection bias. One of the reasons, and probably the main one, that public schools are awful is because a very small number of highly disruptive kids can completely ruin the education of an entire class of other kids. Public schools generally have no way to get rid of these children and their parents also generally don't care. These are also of course the kids that are going to score abysmally…

I’m not sure this “thinking” on public education holds up if you look outside the U.S. where countries with emphasis on public education so consistently outperform the Americans. I guess at best it might be that there’s problems unique to American culture that makes public education not work. But that feels unlikely to hold up. I think the premise is simply wrong.

the “problem” unique to America is that we like to take in the poor and huddled masses (who don’t test well), while the EU likes to watch them sink and die in the Mediterranean.
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