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How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

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Re: How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

#41

Post by Larrikin »

rPlayer6554 wrote: post #34

I’m going to Japan in a week and I’m doing 1 week Tokyo, 2 days Nakasendo trail, 1 week Kyoto, 2 days Hiroshima. (Plus a day leftover I haven’t decided what to do with) Do people have tips to find less touristy but still worthwhile places to go. Tourists go for these big places because traveling to Japan costs quite a bit and I’m using limited vacation time. Planning the trip in a location where the language doesn’t…

If this is your first and possibly only trip, do not try to be too cool. Go to the famous places you've heard about and want to see, especially if you don't speak the language and your ability to get local recommendations will be limited.

Just don't fully pack the day and save time for randomly walking around, especially at night when a not sober Japanese person will be more likely to try out their English and give a recommendation. Your ability to get information and meet people will exponentially increase with every single Japanese word you learn. When I lived there meetup was popular and international parties set you up with people specifically there to practice in a fun environment.

I'm lucky and got to study there and live there. But definitely had regrets my first time going by taking the advice of jaded people who lived there saying things like Tokyo Tower is lame and you can get a better view from some government building. They had all gone and had the experience and I just missed out.

Also,personally I would find a week in Kyoto 6 days too long and find Osaka way more interesting. But I also have been many times and only enjoyed the first time.

Re: How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

#42

Post by mock-possum »

Incipient wrote: post #25

"When in Rome". It's not a guide - it's a hard, fast, unbreakable rule, *especially* in Japan. Obey rules. Follow queues. Don't eat and walk. BE QUIET. Learning some of the language wouldn't go amiss either. I've been to Japan over the last 20 years or so and I've become utterly INFURIATED at tourists from pretty much every country. Yanks and Chinese are loud and obnoxious, Aussies (my group) are woefully uncouth. In…

Why “don’t eat and walk?” What if you’re hungry, and you want to go somewhere? What’s wrong with a snack and a stroll?

Re: How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

#43

Post by Ruthalas »

evertedsphere wrote: post #16
wisty wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

99% of tourists are like that. No real confidence so they don't wander around and use their own brains. They just go to the top 10 spots chatGPT, tiktok, or some other list dictates. It's like how people go to the Louvre and stand in line for 3 hours to look at one famous painting that they probably don't even really like all that much, and not see anything else in arguably the world's best gallery. This is doubly tr…

one tiny famous painting from a cop-enforced distance of god knows how much while an enormous painting full of stuff stands right opposite it

I imagine the curators did this to entertain themselves. I thought it was a great juxtaposition when I visited.

Re: How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

#44

Post by washadjeffmad »

Schiendelman wrote: post #36
washadjeffmad wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Food is cheap, but skilled labor is expensive. In the US, it's common to go out to eat because the reputation and wages of labor for food service have been crushed, but in Japan, asking another human to pour your beers and make you food and then clean up in an izakaya carries an appropriate cost. A friend who'd never left the US was shocked to learn going to teppanyaki cost almost $200/person... and the chef didn't e…

Where on earth was teppanyaki $200/pp?

Tokyo, private room. I'm sorry, I made it sound like that's what it cost at a food court.

It just tickled me so much that he admitted he was a little disappointed that he didn't get an "authentic hibachi experience" like at the Japanese steakhouses back home.

Re: How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

#45

Post by wenc »

washadjeffmad wrote: post #28
Pooge wrote: post #17

I want to copypaste this answer to so many comments in this thread but instead, let me reply to the post directly. I'm going to travel to Japan (again) around late November this year. For this trip, I made a point to not return to a city I've been to already — Tokyo is an exception but I need to take my plane back home at some point. Japan really has a high density when you go to the touristic attractions (most of th…

Food is cheap, but skilled labor is expensive. In the US, it's common to go out to eat because the reputation and wages of labor for food service have been crushed, but in Japan, asking another human to pour your beers and make you food and then clean up in an izakaya carries an appropriate cost. A friend who'd never left the US was shocked to learn going to teppanyaki cost almost $200/person... and the chef didn't e…

> In the US, it's common to go out to eat because the reputation and wages of labor for food service have been crushed, but in Japan, asking another human to pour your beers and make you food and then clean up in an izakaya carries an appropriate cost.

Hmm, unless I'm not getting your point, this seems at variance with the lived experience of most East and Southeast Asians. (I've lived all over the world, mostly in Asia Pacific and North America)

America has relatively high labor cost (plus tax and tips, you're looking at at least $20/meal/person post-covid) and eating out is expensive and it is actually not that common to eat out -- at least not at a sit down restaurant. For most Americans, eating out is maybe a once or twice a week affair.

In most of Asia (including Japan) eating out is relatively cheap and most can afford to do it daily (many young people in Asia don't cook). I don't know if anyone goes to Japan to eat $200 teppanyaki or that izakayas are a daily affair, but most meals in Japan cost under US$10. An udon is under $5, and a gyudon (beef, soup, rice) at Yoshinoya costs under $5. No tax or tip -- you pay sticker price.

Re: How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

#46

Post by evertedsphere »

Ruthalas wrote: post #43
evertedsphere wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

one tiny famous painting from a cop-enforced distance of god knows how much while an enormous painting full of stuff stands right opposite it

I imagine the curators did this to entertain themselves. I thought it was a great juxtaposition when I visited.

oh, totally

what i intended to point out was that regrettably few people actually pay any attention to the nozze di cana despite it being both more accessible physically and worthy of interest

Re: How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

#47

Post by Incipient »

mock-possum wrote: post #42
Incipient wrote: post #25

"When in Rome". It's not a guide - it's a hard, fast, unbreakable rule, *especially* in Japan. Obey rules. Follow queues. Don't eat and walk. BE QUIET. Learning some of the language wouldn't go amiss either. I've been to Japan over the last 20 years or so and I've become utterly INFURIATED at tourists from pretty much every country. Yanks and Chinese are loud and obnoxious, Aussies (my group) are woefully uncouth. In…

Why “don’t eat and walk?” What if you’re hungry, and you want to go somewhere? What’s wrong with a snack and a stroll?

You don't do that in Japan, it's considered taboo. You eat, then stroll. Take the time, enjoy the food, then go about your business of travel.

Japan has incredibly few bins in public for that reason/as a result of that reason.

Re: How Kyoto, Japan Became the Loveliest Tourist-Trap

#48

Post by bamboozled »

mitthrowaway2 wrote: post #29
bamboozled wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I'm a bit confused about is why Japan doesn't just make more wonderful things , so there is just more to go around? Like what happened to building amazing temples, and gardens? Where did that spirit go. I find it quite sad and strange that the temples are kind of ghost towns without any practicing monks (for example). I guess that time is over, and that's sad, I just don't feel like it has to be. Maybe the decli…

There are actually a lot of other amazing temples, gardens, and shrines, they're just not as well known. And there's a healthy industry of traditional craftsmen who still build and maintain shrines, temples, and other buildings the traditional way. Kyoto will continue gobbling up the crowds no matter how many other alternatives there are because that's the nature of tourism, but it's not for a shortage of other beaut…

There is more to go around, but there is a practical limit to how much you can see as a tourist in a limited window with good public transport access etc.
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