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Gentoo Linux might be the best desktop Linux distro for advanced Linux users

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Re: Gentoo Linux might be the best desktop Linux distro for advanced Linux users

#41

Post by bravetraveler »

brnt wrote: post #40
bravetraveler wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you confusing Debian and Ubuntu? No, you're confusing exclusivity. https://launchpad.net/debian/+ppas

No, I know PPA's are just a way of telling apt about a repository. What I mean is that Debian does not support adding PPA by default island I frankly don't hear of many Debian users doing that. Flatpak/-hub is much more common.

I don't know what to tell you/say, it's a completely supported - and utilized - method for distributing software. For both Debian and Ubuntu. "By default" is completely irrelevant, let me explain.

First, somewhat sarcastically, I can give you that support right here. "echo ... | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/...". Go forth and prosper.

Now, more seriously/importantly, this is for distributing user-supplied software. The point I was originally making is that anyone can leverage this, it's not representative of the Distribution. AUR, PPA, COPR (for your RHEL derivative of choice), OBS, whatever. The malware is the responsibility of the user who published it, not the Distribution maintainers.

Aside: I'm deliberately trying use 'distribution' as a proper noun/capitalize where appropriate... in terms of the composite of software we know as Debian or Ubuntu, not an individual release like the 'software-properties-common' package or malware: what started this thread.

Back on topic: this is firmly down the path of customization. The fact that you don't get 'add-apt-repository' for free is, again, irrelevant. PPAs will distribute (heh) Deb packages for either Distribution.

If we're working off anecdotes, I hear about far more Sources [repo] files being made on Debian than Flatpak installations. Now what do we do.

Re: Gentoo Linux might be the best desktop Linux distro for advanced Linux users

#43

Post by firefax »

As a libertarian on social issues, I think you should be able to use whatever flavor of linux you want -- but Gentoo seems to be for people who really want to get into the nitty gritty :-)

For me, I prefer Debian. No ad crap like Ubuntu, decent userbase with several popular security distros (Parrot, Kali) based on it, so lots of eyeballs. And fairly usable, especially if you switch over to XFCE so you're not wasting resources on flashy graphics.

Re: Gentoo Linux might be the best desktop Linux distro for advanced Linux users

#44

Post by jcalvinowens »

I've been using Gentoo for almost twenty years!

Patching libraries is easier than any other distro. Just throw the patch in

    /etc/portage/patches/${package}/${name}/
...run one emerge command, and your entire system is now linked to the patched library. For example one of my machines has:

    /etc/portage/patches/media-libs/svt-av1/0001-Address-build-warnings-and-CI-failures-from-enabling.patch
...which is a backport to fix a build error with avx512 enabled.

Same for debugging and cflags, I simply have:

    {0}[calvinow@sousa ~] cat /etc/portage/env/debug-cflags 
    FEATURES="${FEATURES} nostrip"
    COMMON_FLAGS="-Og -ggdb3 -fno-omit-frame-pointer -pipe"
    ...
...and then rebuilding any package with debug cflags is one vim+emerge away:

    {0}[calvinow@sousa ~] cat /etc/portage/package.env/20debug
    media-libs/x264 debug-cflags
    media-libs/x265 debug-cflags
    media-video/ffmpeg debug-cflags

Re: Gentoo Linux might be the best desktop Linux distro for advanced Linux users

#46

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

It might. OTOH when using binpkgs and not changing USE-flags, using a fully optimized Archlinux-derivative like CachyOS might too. Depending on how much hypercustomized additional crap you need/intend to use.

Been in the situation to chose a while ago, been wary of having to compile all that crap, because that's what USE-flags are for :-) (Wenn schon, denn schon! (Meaning something like 'going all in' in german)) Thought about NetBSD, and FreeBSD too, but nah, because drivers. Knew Arch. It's lean, or can be, but not that optimized. Came across CachyOS.

Gave it a try. Feeling very comfy with it at speed. Enables real "Freude am Fahrvergnügen/Spaß am Gerät" without hassle. Not seeing the need to change.

Re: Gentoo Linux might be the best desktop Linux distro for advanced Linux users

#47

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

veber-alex wrote: post #19

Twenty years ago, Gentoo taught me Linux. A friend and I wanted to play around with Linux, so we installed Mandrake[1] Linux on a school PC. We didn't know what we were doing, and the GUI (I think it was KDE3?) abstracted too much. It was also very unstable. I don't remember how I got to know about Gentoo, but I then proceeded to install and reinstall Gentoo on my home PC (Athlon 64) about 20 times, and this was when…

Ah, the joys of having a fully split up KDE3 in Gentoo, enabling you to install just the parts you wanted to. So sexy. Sigh...

Regarding Mandriva/Mandrake, I'm remembering that as having the cleanest /etc with just the relevant information in its config files, generated by the installer. And not copy/pasted crap like it was common on Debian, then. PC-LinuxOS took that approach, too. But RPM, nay!

As to learning effect, I'm doubtful.

https://www.linuxfromscratch.org/ would be more appropriate for the foundations.

With Gentoo, you're just learning their abstractions, as flexible as they may be.

Which one could nowadays do in any virtual machine, as time and motivation permits.

Because suspendable on demand. Continue later.

Then trying that thing on real iron, and maybe replacing the virtualization host with it, when it passed the smoke test :-)

Which applies to both, LFS & Gentoo.

Re: Gentoo Linux might be the best desktop Linux distro for advanced Linux users

#49

Post by brnt »

bravetraveler wrote: post #41
brnt wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I know PPA's are just a way of telling apt about a repository. What I mean is that Debian does not support adding PPA by default island I frankly don't hear of many Debian users doing that. Flatpak/-hub is much more common.

I don't know what to tell you/say, it's a completely supported - and utilized - method for distributing software. For both Debian and Ubuntu. "By default" is completely irrelevant, let me explain. First, somewhat sarcastically, I can give you that support right here. "echo ... | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/..." . Go forth and prosper. Now, more seriously/importantly, this is for distributing user-supplied softwa…

Defaults matter. By default, Debian can't add PPA's.

Re: Gentoo Linux might be the best desktop Linux distro for advanced Linux users

#50

Post by bravetraveler »

brnt wrote: post #49
bravetraveler wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what to tell you/say, it's a completely supported - and utilized - method for distributing software. For both Debian and Ubuntu. "By default" is completely irrelevant, let me explain. First, somewhat sarcastically, I can give you that support right here. "echo ... | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/..." . Go forth and prosper. Now, more seriously/importantly, this is for distributing user-supplied softwa…

Defaults matter. By default, Debian can't add PPA's.

Yes it can, I just showed how one might. A repo is a repo. A PPA is a repo. What?

The 'default' you're talking about is a CLI that simplifies two steps, one of which is optional [signature]. It can be done with a shell/coreutils or whatever equivalent. Again, I showed my work.

Anyway, let's toss Flatpak, then. Debian only offers it, not by default. Just like it only offers the ability to write to '/etc/apt/sources.list.d/'.

I'm done going back/forth on this, we're so far off the point. Use the distribution you want, be mindful of the software you install. Regardless of who wrote/built the manifests or hosted the artifacts.

Bagging on Arch for the AUR makes as much sense as for . I already named several, it's all user-generated content. In absolutely no way does it represent the actual product/distribution. The users publishing and consuming carry the responsibility.

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