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Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

swissinfo.ch

41–50 of 69 posts

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#41
post #2

There’s nothing inherently wrong with e-ID, it can be mighty useful, especially when implemented thoughtfully. The real problem is when it’s imposed despite widespread societal opposition and refusal (which obviously is not the issue here, but is in other countries).

The inherently wrong part about it is that it is extremely easy to revoke at the push of a button, vs a physical card that must be physically confiscated.

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#42
post #2

There’s nothing inherently wrong with e-ID, it can be mighty useful, especially when implemented thoughtfully. The real problem is when it’s imposed despite widespread societal opposition and refusal (which obviously is not the issue here, but is in other countries).

I hate that everything is being pushed onto the phone. Its a single point of failure.

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#44
post #40
post #39

A sad development. At least in the US, the fact that rent is taxable income to the landlord but imputed rent is untaxed is a regressive tax break for property owners (and was apparently a mistake of the original Form 1040; see Lawrence Zelenak, “The Early Income Tax and the Imputed Rental Income of Homeowners” https://doi.org/10.1017/9781108377157.008 ). I wonder what convinced majority-renter Swiss voters to enact s…

Wages are taxable income to workers but imputed wages are untaxed. That’s a regressive tax break for people who cook their own food and care for their own children.

lol but it’s true. The less productive stuff you do outside the formal economy the more value you get to keep. That’s why digital cash is so problematic

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#45
post #26
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s actually “imputed rental value tax”. The point is fairness, not progressiveness. The idea is, if you live in your own house, you’re no better off than if you lived in another property and rented out your property, and paid the tax on the rent you get. It’s supposed to reduce friction / bias in the market (though you could also obviously argue the reverse).

So everyone is a permanent renter ?

Yes

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#46
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do any of these schemes ensure that votes can't be traced back to individuals? Secrecy is an important part of voting.

Different systems have different approaches. If you're a voter, you can use your web browser's developer tools to see what's going on, and part of my research is essentially doing that with systems like this. With one Ontario online voting system used by dozens of municipalities, your choice is sent via a form submission (POST) to the server. The POST contains your choice in its body (in plain text) and your browser…

I really enjoy these detailed answers

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#47
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like that it is open source, I don't like that they use SD-JWT tokens which contain hashes of people's names for things like age verification.

It's only partially open source. Some server-side code remains proprietary, and the client-side will depend on proprietary code of Google and Apple and they do not plan to support platforms that are actually Free Software. The law overall is badly written. For example, articles 12 and 26 effectively say that "The source is shared with public, except if it is proprietary or insecure." Or take Article 4: "The governmen…

The Swiyu team dropped the Play Integrity requirement on Android: https://github.com/swiyu-admin-ch/eidch-android-wallet/issue... This means that the E-ID will be officially supported on AOSP based secure ROMs like GrapheneOS, without any requirement for Google services.

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#48
post #2

There’s nothing inherently wrong with e-ID, it can be mighty useful, especially when implemented thoughtfully. The real problem is when it’s imposed despite widespread societal opposition and refusal (which obviously is not the issue here, but is in other countries).

I agree that it can be useful, but I fear that in the future, we will have many more online platforms that require an ID than we currently do. In the past, things like age verification required users to upload a scan or photo, and someone had to verify it. Because that was too much work for the platform operators, they didn't do it (or only with the banner "Are you over 18?"). With the e-ID instead, this will be much…

Even though I am for the eID I do share your worry but I don‘t think it‘s hopeless. Both politically and socially there are avenues to combat such over-identification. Still, most uses will probably more private than sharing copies of your ID so I am not sure what the gain for companies will be as it might just limit the customer base without much data gained. That does not seem in the interest of those companies. It‘s easier for the government to enforce certain checks, which is also not ideal but still there are avenues to fight this if it happens.

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#49

Switzerland is transitioning to online voting, and having a digital ID for authentication is helpful for that. I hope it is used as part of the voting process. My understanding is that the current approach for e-voting in Switzerland works with voters being sent a PIN in the mail [1]. Then the voter uses the PIN to log into the system and vote. Unfortunately that means that insecurely discarded letters from non-voter…

As always, relevant xkcd: https://xkcd.com/2030

Re: Swiss voters back e-ID and abolish rental tax

#50
post #27
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Optional meaning you have the choice of using the existing physical ID. I don't see how this is deceptive. "A lot of pressure" is not the same as being unable to legally work without the digital ID.

Because they did advertise it in a way to make people believe they could still do their things online without an E-ID, which will not be the case. It's not optional online.

Companies can already request and will still be able to request a PDF scan of your ID. Or worse, video ident through a private third party.

This is the status quo for ordering alcohol online, or if you want to open a bank account.

The new E-ID based on SSI (self-sovereign identity) is so much better than the status quo from a real-world privacy perspective towards companies that must verify your identity or age.

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