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The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

grimoiremanor.substack.com

41–50 of 69 posts

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#41

First it was rock and roll, then video games, then cell phones. When all along it’s been lack of mental health care in general. This shouldn’t be a surprise.

Don't you think rap music has a negative influence? Or pornography? When was it decided that it's not true that popular culture and technology can have a destructive influence on people? This was decided before I was born, so why should it be my duty to accept it as true? The more I notice this, the more crazy it seems. When was it decided that the TV should be center in every home and treated like the most important…

Because before rap, it was rnb. Before RnB, it was Rock. Before Rock, it was Jazz, before Jazz, it was Blues, and before Blues, it was any music containing thirds or sevenths.

Popular music is just that: popular, and since people like to appear distinct from the masses, some do it via music.

I don't disagree with the rest, but 'rap music has a negative influence' is extremely reactionary.

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#42

This article's methodology leaves a lot to be desired. They throw out dozens of studies with a flippant, poorly justified dismissal and then proceed to take a cursory, high-level glance over a single other study that supported their desired conclusion. Having given that study a passing thought they proceed to wonder at "just how glaring this data is" from that single report and how it is that everyone else can't see…

the entire field of K-12 education also is based on a bunch of "non sense" historical stuff, like tests; which came from industrial revolution times where owners wanted to check who would be less likely to break their expensive machines by comparing who remembered more operation steps... which by now pedagogic science knows it's a great way to retain information but as it's done in most school environments is a completely absurd. go try to suggest a change on the system or even implement something effective, cheap and well known as retrieval practice on the school schedule

transfer of learning is a scientific fact but what are the applications of a bunch of stuff we need to learn as teens? Linus Pauling's thesis that won a Nobel? again, transfer of learning isn't a magic bullet that its effects spans across everything you do in your life, nor it's an easy concept to explain to children and get them convinced that learning stuff that you'll forget in some months or years is actually good!

then we have the amount of stuff parsed to children. take a look at data showing the amount of subjects of science taught on North Americans schools and Japanese; now take a look which culture has a better understanding of science!

etc.

schools needs to grow on other areas than parsing knowledge of the natural world, like emotional resilience, collaboration skills, how to deal with grief, not increasing score metrics that also has a problem on its own, like letting behind some districts (thus making it worse) that don't have resources to keep with advancement; and to make a counterpoint with the website OP, i strongly believe and trust professionals teaching children these skills than a bunch of unprepared parents that i have my doubts even half of them actually spend any time reading evidence based tips on how to grow children, let alone meta-thinking about their relationship with them

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#43
post #40

This article's methodology leaves a lot to be desired. They throw out dozens of studies with a flippant, poorly justified dismissal and then proceed to take a cursory, high-level glance over a single other study that supported their desired conclusion. Having given that study a passing thought they proceed to wonder at "just how glaring this data is" from that single report and how it is that everyone else can't see…

I don't see why teen suicide rate is the definitive measure of how well children are doing. It's still extremely rare. Why not focus on anti-depressants? Surely kids being on a lot of meds is a sign something is off. Everyone knows phones are a net negative for most children. You really don't need a study. Just go check out a local bus stop and see kids staring at their phones. > The median amount of time a teenager…

> Surely kids being on a lot of meds is a sign something is off.

Couldn't this just be a sign of overmedication? I can't see a clear cut causal relationship here.

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#44

Suicide rate is a strange metric to choose here. I believe smartphones are exceptionally damaging to teens, but the biggest effect is around their attention span and motivation. The biggest mental health effect is the ADHD epidemic it's bringing on.

Is it bringing on ADHD? It appears to me more like now that we can help people with ADHD it is worth the bother to diagnose people with it so they can get help. I'm pretty sure I have some rare things myself, but a quick investigation suggests there is nothing useful that could be done if I was diagnosed it isn't worth bothering to get an official diagnosis.

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#45
post #42

This article's methodology leaves a lot to be desired. They throw out dozens of studies with a flippant, poorly justified dismissal and then proceed to take a cursory, high-level glance over a single other study that supported their desired conclusion. Having given that study a passing thought they proceed to wonder at "just how glaring this data is" from that single report and how it is that everyone else can't see…

the entire field of K-12 education also is based on a bunch of "non sense" historical stuff, like tests; which came from industrial revolution times where owners wanted to check who would be less likely to break their expensive machines by comparing who remembered more operation steps... which by now pedagogic science knows it's a great way to retain information but as it's done in most school environments is a compl…

>schools needs to grow on other areas than parsing knowledge of the natural world, like emotional resilience, collaboration skills, how to deal with grief

I too support more investment in good old fashioned sports and arts.

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#46
In 1988, California enacted a mental health parity law which private insurers to provide equal coverage for mental health and substance use disorder treatments, including services for children. There was a resultant explosion of rehab centers for kids opening in CA. Kids (mostly mid-upper class white kids) got put into rehab centers en masse. Suddenly, every parent in a dysfunctional family could point their fingers at the ubiquitous use of drugs (mostly alcohol and cannabis) among teens and thus absolve themselves of their personal failings as a parent.

Of course I am not arguing that kegger parties and smoking weed were positive things for kids, and certainly some small % of these kids were doing worse drugs, but I am quite certain from my own (fairly broad) annecdata that the root cause of these kids' self destructive behavior was their fucked up families.

And now parents can point their fingers at social media. History repeats, but the difference this time is that kids aren't put into rehabs away from the family dysfunction and in an environment where some degree of self examination and self work is promoted.

When I was very young, I thought that my family dysfunction was an outlier, but my experiences in life lead me to believe that it is the norm and that healthy families are the outlier. Of course, that's my own experience, but I am a greybeard now and have interacted with a large number of individuals across the full spectrum of social strata so the assessment of my anecdata sure seems more poignant with each passing year...

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#47

This article's methodology leaves a lot to be desired. They throw out dozens of studies with a flippant, poorly justified dismissal and then proceed to take a cursory, high-level glance over a single other study that supported their desired conclusion. Having given that study a passing thought they proceed to wonder at "just how glaring this data is" from that single report and how it is that everyone else can't see…

I think one of the problems is that Substack has as much editorial oversight as a personal blog. Despite that we treat its contents as articles instead of opinion pieces that see no fact checking beyond what we in the commons bring up in separate forums.

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#48
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see why teen suicide rate is the definitive measure of how well children are doing. It's still extremely rare. Why not focus on anti-depressants? Surely kids being on a lot of meds is a sign something is off. Everyone knows phones are a net negative for most children. You really don't need a study. Just go check out a local bus stop and see kids staring at their phones. > The median amount of time a teenager…

> Surely kids being on a lot of meds is a sign something is off. Couldn't this just be a sign of overmedication? I can't see a clear cut causal relationship here.

[deleted]

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#49

First it was rock and roll, then video games, then cell phones. When all along it’s been lack of mental health care in general. This shouldn’t be a surprise.

Yeah; this all rings pretty sound to me. I've worked with 14-17 year olds most of my adult life and everything comes down to how the kid does in their "home" environment. More specifically, how their closest people treat them, rather than any action they are taking. Kids - even 17 year olds - are infantalized and treated as if they don't have anything to contribute. They are "supposed" to just do what they are told a…

Yes, I feel that a lot of things touted are the symptoms and not the causes. Interested to know if the quantity of kids you are seeing having problems is increasing though?

Re: The Problem with Teens Isn't Smartphones–It's Their Families

#50
post #47

This article's methodology leaves a lot to be desired. They throw out dozens of studies with a flippant, poorly justified dismissal and then proceed to take a cursory, high-level glance over a single other study that supported their desired conclusion. Having given that study a passing thought they proceed to wonder at "just how glaring this data is" from that single report and how it is that everyone else can't see…

I think one of the problems is that Substack has as much editorial oversight as a personal blog. Despite that we treat its contents as articles instead of opinion pieces that see no fact checking beyond what we in the commons bring up in separate forums.

I would have used the word 'article' for any post in this format and I don't view that as giving it an elevated status. I didn't even notice it was Substack and certainly don't view Substack as any different than WordPress or Medium for reliability.

It's an article of writing the way that a shirt is an article of clothing.

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