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Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

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Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#41

Post by steamrolled »

IG_Semmelweiss wrote: post #33

>>> overnment agencies have paid for versions of encrypted messaging apps that also have archive abilities before. In 2021, Customs and Border Protection (CBP) paid encrypted app company Wickr $700,000. This seems like a perfect use case to support Signal. Have large, corporate or govt entities, pay for a custom fork of the app, built by the app developers themselves. Why is telemessage getting the money ? Does the S…

If Signal becomes financially dependent on government contracts, the govt gains a lot of leverage over the app. I'm not sure that's a great position for this particular platform to be in.

Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#43

Post by defen »

tptacek wrote: post #16
cge wrote: post #14

As some details: TeleMessage is/was an Israeli company [1], but was acquired last year by Smarsh [2], itself a subsidiary of K1 Investment Management, both US companies. It me whether the company moved. While not necessarily related at all, their terms of service also seem to explain specific arrangements for messaging in China that appear to involve disclosures to the Chinese government. It's unclear to me how the a…

Smarsh is apparently a big deal in the compliance space. They're not randos. That doesn't take away the hilarity of using a Signal clone that defeats the whole purpose of Signal, though.

Additional hilarity provided by their name being one letter different from the latinisation of a Soviet spy agency / Bond supervillain organization.

Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#44

Post by dmix »

IG_Semmelweiss wrote: post #33

>>> overnment agencies have paid for versions of encrypted messaging apps that also have archive abilities before. In 2021, Customs and Border Protection (CBP) paid encrypted app company Wickr $700,000. This seems like a perfect use case to support Signal. Have large, corporate or govt entities, pay for a custom fork of the app, built by the app developers themselves. Why is telemessage getting the money ? Does the S…

90% of the work is probably compliance and gov contract hoop jumping, not the code.

Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#45

Post by wmf »

fluidcruft wrote: post #19
cge wrote: post #14

As some details: TeleMessage is/was an Israeli company [1], but was acquired last year by Smarsh [2], itself a subsidiary of K1 Investment Management, both US companies. It me whether the company moved. While not necessarily related at all, their terms of service also seem to explain specific arrangements for messaging in China that appear to involve disclosures to the Chinese government. It's unclear to me how the a…

Just wondering... if you work for a company and your employer provides you with modified GPL software, it's not considered distributed to you in ways that GPL would apply (so you are not free to further distribute it). At least that's how GPLv2 used to be explained as as business friendly--"private" modifications remain private and employees are not considered exterbal distribution. I'm not familiar with AGPL though.

The realpolitik here is that you can get fired if you leak the code, legal or not.

Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#46

Post by sorcerer-mar »

Den_VR wrote: post #40
sorcerer-mar wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Approved for government use: https://www.cisa.gov/sites/default/files/2024-12/guidance-mo... Not approved for non-public DOD information: https://dodcio.defense.gov/Portals/0/Documents/Library/Memo-...

Guidance from CISA (an agency within the Department of Homeland Security) does not translate to an Approval for DOD. The DOD memo does not supersede other DOD instructions referenced by the memo requiring RMF and NIAP things.

We're saying the same thing, It's "use Signal for everything you'd use Whatsapp or SMS for, and use the standard secure channels for anything you'd typically need a secure channel for."

Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#47

Post by brookst »

fiddlerwoaroof wrote: post #32
ezst wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Signal is approved for government use [Ref. needed]

From last year after Salt Typhoon became public: > Adopt a free messaging application for secure communications that guarantees end-to-end encryption, such as Signal or similar apps. CISA recommends an end-to-end encrypted messaging app that is compatible with both iPhone and Android operating systems, allowing for text message interoperability across platforms. https://www.cisa.gov/sites/default/files/2024-12/guidan…

As Dev_VR said, that is a recommendation from CISA to private sector users, not an approval for DOD users.

Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#48

Post by schoen »

defen wrote: post #43
tptacek wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smarsh is apparently a big deal in the compliance space. They're not randos. That doesn't take away the hilarity of using a Signal clone that defeats the whole purpose of Signal, though.

Additional hilarity provided by their name being one letter different from the latinisation of a Soviet spy agency / Bond supervillain organization.

It looks like it was originally meant as a reference to the username of the founder (Stephen Marsh).

Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#49

Post by chrisco255 »

ceejayoz wrote: post #12
firesteelrain wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

6 days ago there was the Hegseth article regarding this being hotly debated in here and it’s a great example of not having all the facts before jumping to conclusions. Part of the debate was regarding archiving of messages which now apparently there is a way to archive Signal messages automatically. Huh who would have figured

Great motivated thinking, but wrong. It would appear they're using this app now , post-incident, because they got in trouble. (And having messages with Vance, Gabbard, etc. be visible to the press pool camera is... not a great look for the guy who accidentally added a reporter.) https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/15/us/politics/cia-director-... > All of the messages from a leaked group chat have been deleted from the ph…

Those are just accusations from a 3rd party agency. They have no way of knowing if Ratcliffe archived the messages before deleting. Signal has been approved since the Biden admin. It was most likely already distributed with the Telemessage feature.

Re: Mike Waltz Accidentally Reveals App Govt Uses to Archive Signal Messages

#50

Post by dmix »

poink wrote: post #11
_heimdall wrote: post #3

It seems reasonable enough that the government may have built a forked version of signal with message archiving that meets documentation requirements. If its an app they wanted kept under wraps, it will make the while Hegseth situation seem a lot more benign. I use Molly Messenger on a secondary phone that doesn't have a SIM, its a fork of Signal with a few differences related to encryption at rest. It still works wi…

It's not only reasonable the US government should be archiving communications between officials, it should be compulsory. We've already had problems with this re: agents of government agencies like CBP and big bankers using E2EE messaging apps to skirt regulatory requirements. That said, whether this makes the situation better or worse depends on who can actually see these archives. "Smarsh" is a US-based company, bu…

Some of the top US government IT contractors are British, Canadian, and Italian owned companies. Running servers in the US for a government contract isn’t a big deal at a technical level.
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