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Moving away from US cloud services

martijnhols.nl

41–50 of 383 posts

Re: Moving away from US cloud services

#41
post #7

I find the Proton tools to be a joy to use and I use them for my business. For clients, I can't do that to them. Microsoft completely dominates and people just expect to be able to video call, chat, work on docs, etc. MS365 remains incredible value for money and pretty optimal for normies.

I recently had to use MS365 for a short time and I hated every moment.

Re: Moving away from US cloud services

#42
Privacy rights in the EU are being eroded as we speak. Unless people there get off their high horse, they'll succumb to the same level of authoritarianism and surveillance as in the states.

Also, sorry, but the idea that EU countries are in any position to build a serious hyperscaler is pure fiction. Growth, funding, risk, innovation - those are alien concepts to European entrepreneurs.

Re: Moving away from US cloud services

#43
post #30

One relatively simple thing we're missing on the Swedish cloud market is someone offering OIDC SSO, Chat, Video meetings, e-mail, calendar and file sharing. I can't even say which European company offers this, Proton maybe? Being a long time open source advocate I think it can be done, but system integration would never be as good as MS or Google. But this simple platform would get a lot of SMB's to migrate.

Legally Proton is not based in European Union nor European Economic Area. Switzerland is extra EU just like USA, China or Russia

The European Commission has recognized the Swiss Data Protection Act as equivalent to the GDPR. This allows data to continue to flow freely between Switzerland and the EU.

Re: Moving away from US cloud services

#44
post #33
post #29

The biggest elephants in the room are cloud providers, but I didn't find an easy alternative yet (hetzner, ovhcloud). ATM, the idea to the business is sold, that data resides somewhere near by in a datacenter, EU proximity. However, the EU businesses are realising that, well, whole region is at a mercy of one person.

OVH and Hetzner are excellent companies. I doubt there would be any problem with them in the future.

Both companies are excellent, and I'd absolutely trust them with my business, but neither can replace something like AWS. The friends I have at companies who are actively using AWS are all relying on a fairly large number of AWS only services. Either they'd need to stand up their own replacements and host those services on VMs, or in some cases rewrite parts of their stack.

E.g. if you're using AWS Cognito then you're not going anywhere.

Re: Moving away from US cloud services

#45
A shame that OP recommends Proton. The fact they don't support open email protocols like IMAP/SMTP without an extremely frustrating proxy setup is what ultimately turned me away from their service. Being able to "just" use a native mail client is pretty much a must.

The vendor lock-in from something like Proton feels way worse as a result.

Can't speak to Proton Pass, but it strikes me as a replacement that seems unnecessary: if Bitwarden is a problem, the server can be selfhosted, something which the OP seems to be familiar with.

Some of the others feel of more... questionable issues to have with US cloud services; it's hard to find problems with Dockerhub and NPM that aren't just general problems with these services/the company behind them (mainly NPM). Maybe that's just because the public/private concern for both of those services is pretty different than the others mentioned here.

Re: Moving away from US cloud services

#48
post #21
post #11

I wonder if shifting to cloud providers in the EU will lead to the rise of giant European cloud companies in both technology and infrastructure, or if this is just a short-term trend.

I'd like that. Personally, I prefer to self host all my stuff. But I can't do that to our clients. I want to provide them with something that makes them independent from us, something they can just hire any random agency or freelancer to work on. That leaves AWS and Azure as strong options. There's a number of European cloud providers ( https://www.stackit.de looks especially interesting), but I'm looking for too-big…

> I want to provide them with something that makes them independent from us, something they can just hire any random agency or freelancer to work on.

I have the same attitude and regularly find (sales) people not understanding why I'm doing this. They are pathologically looking for my angle. But there's none.

Re: Moving away from US cloud services

#49
Regarding Startpage: https://www.startpage.com/privacy-please/startpage-articles/...

https://web.archive.org/web/20210729190016/https://support.s...

The original link is dead for some reason: https://support.startpage.com/index.php?/Knowledgebase/Artic...

TL;DR: Startpage appears owned by an ad company? https://web.archive.org/web/https://www.bizjournals.com/losa...

Could someone explain to me how an ad company and a privacy company work together? Seems like opposing interests?

Maybe Ecosia will be a good alternative later on: https://blog.ecosia.org/eusp/

Another suggestion would be https://searx.space/

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