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Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

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Re: Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

#41
post #4

It's not normal to start dreaming as you fall asleep ? I thought that's how you know you're falling asleep? That you're starting to see the dreams?

Generally, the earlier stages of sleep are categorized by more "deep" sleep, with REM (dreams) occurring later. Narcolepsy Type 1 (NT1) is characterized by inappropriately entering REM sleep, likely due to a deficiency in orexin-producing neurons.

Re: Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

#42
post #16
post #2

(N1 over here aswell! Although mine came from some unfortunate circumstances rather than from birth ) Pleasantly surprised to find an article/blog on narcolepsy on HN. All of the described experiences sound familiar, except the vivid dreaming while awake. Sleep paralysis, been there, always having dreams when asleep, yup (although for me MOST dreams are also lucid, which can get kind of get tiring, as I feel like I d…

I recently got diagnosed but i somehow managed to be very productive all the way until my 30s. I had a spinal injury and turned it up 10x and its ruining my life. Any advice? The medication doesn’t come close to keeping me awake and writing code… do i just keep taking more amphetamines and caffeine until i can? I exercise, eat well etc etc

Sorry to hear. There is a promising new class of drugs, orexin agonists, currently in clinical trials. Particularly, TAK-861 had excellent phase 2b results and is currently in phase 3 trials.

I don't have narcolepsy, but I wonder whether something like a yoga nidra/non-sleep deep rest practice might help.

Re: Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

#44
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you prescribed? Similar situation; still trying to find the right meds.

* Modafinil (400mg, 1x daily) - Started with 100mg and tried several variations of timing/dosage. Currently, 400mg upon waking in the morning has worked the best. * Duloxetine (30mg, 2x daily) My PCP prescribed the Duloxetine early in the process when they suspected I had ME/CFS. It did not seem to do much other than make me feel calm in situations that would normally cause anxiety, but later I got the IH diagnosis a…

I was prescribed Modafinil, and while it did keep me from falling asleep, it didn't help with my wakefulness otherwise. When I had a serious crash, instead of sleeping through most of it, I would be awake through it all, with all the discomfort of the extreme fatigue and mental fog, but with no ability to fast forward time by sleeping through it. After a few months I decided it wasn't worth it.

I'm on methylphenidate right now, and while reports are that it makes CFS worse, I find it helps me to remain more aware and capable when I start getting quite sleepy, to the point where I can often wait it out rather than having to actually fall asleep. It doesn't seem to have changed the frequency of attacks nor did it prevent the really big ones, but I was able to at least work most days whereas before I was regularly too foggy to do much of anything.

The other medication my doctor suggested was Xyrem. While the research is promising for treating IH specifically, the effects and risks are worrying enough that I don't think it's worth it. It's also very expensive and it seems unlikely that my insurance would cover it, since it's off-label usage.

Re: Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

#45
post #36

I have some of those minor symptoms. One thing I have experienced is lying in bed and being unable to move, and I can't tell why. it seems like I'm just not trying to move, which I think is the feeling that distinguishes it from paralysis. What I have found is I can open my eyes and move them around. Through this I discovered an exercise that helps. If I focus on the ceiling in the far left side of the room then swit…

> has made me wonder if laziness is not actually a real thing

I think a lot about the insane drive that professional athletes (especially at the highest levels) have and how it's not possible for me to have the same drive. I'm sure it's complicated and there's some level of learning or skill training that's possible to change your amount of laziness or drive. But, like physical abilities, there's probably only so much you can change.

Re: Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

#47
post #9

This is fascinating. Three years ago, after recovering from COVID, along with many long haul symptoms I developed several similar to but still distinct from narcolepsy. Even now as the CFS-like symptoms have mostly faded, the narcoleptic symptoms are still present. Unfortunately I've not been able to get a positive diagnosis of any sort because it's atypical. There are two main symptoms I experience. First is that, o…

It sounds different from what I’ve been dealing with, but I got diagnosed with sleep apnea in 2023 and getting on a cpap has made a world of difference to my health and energy levels, including making my chronic migraines go away basically completely since starting cpap therapy. I am simply writing this in the hopes that possibly exploring this diagnosis might help you. I used to often wake up exhausted and feeling l…

I appreciate the suggestion. They tested me twice for sleep apnea.

The first time it was borderline so we decided that was unlikely to be the cause. That was also just a few months after COVID when my symptoms were extreme and persistent and I was also experiencing major insomnia.

The second time was a year later when I was supposed to be getting the multiple sleep latency test for narcolepsy. I had an awful time getting to sleep and only had a few hours. They didn't complete the narcolepsy test because they said I had severe apnea. The doctor prescribed me a CPAP and insisted it would fix everything. They went so far as to say that it's never narcolepsy and that in 10 years they had only seen one case, which is concerning given that narcolepsy is not that rare in the general population and it should be much more common among people who are tested for it. The doctor's over confidence and condescending tone made me greatly question the diagnosis.

I did try the CPAP for a little over a month. I simply couldn't make it work. I started with a nasal mask but the first time I opened my mouth I awoke in a panic as air was rushing through my nose and out my mouth. It happened a couple more times and it was clear that wasn't going to work. I then tried a full mask and while that wasn't as bad, I found it extremely hard to fall asleep. Even though I didn't find it uncomfortable, I simply didn't feel sleepy while wearing it. The moment I took it off I would be exhausted and would fall asleep. I also had trouble breathing with it. When the pressure started to rise I wasn't able to breathe out against it so I would suffocate. It woke me many times. Much later I was told that there should be a release valve for that and a different mask might help, but I had already given up on it.

Other circumstances also make me doubtful that sleep apnea is the cause. It has slowly but steadily been improving over the last two years, which shouldn't happen with SA. I have also used various sleep trackers, including recording myself, and with rare exception there haven't been any significant signs of apnea. I snore, but not loudly. I never stop breathing for any length of time. I cough occasionally but I also do that regularly while awake in bed because of post nasal drip. Even the CPAP when I was using it recorded only a few significant events. Aside from that single test, all other evidence has suggested against it.

My wife does have significant sleep apnea. She struggled similar to me with wearing the CPAP but she was recently prescribed APAP and it has worked well for her. Even with the CPAP there was a clear difference when she used it.

I have no doubt it works for many people, but unfortunately it didn't seem to help me.

Re: Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

#48
post #16
post #2

(N1 over here aswell! Although mine came from some unfortunate circumstances rather than from birth ) Pleasantly surprised to find an article/blog on narcolepsy on HN. All of the described experiences sound familiar, except the vivid dreaming while awake. Sleep paralysis, been there, always having dreams when asleep, yup (although for me MOST dreams are also lucid, which can get kind of get tiring, as I feel like I d…

I recently got diagnosed but i somehow managed to be very productive all the way until my 30s. I had a spinal injury and turned it up 10x and its ruining my life. Any advice? The medication doesn’t come close to keeping me awake and writing code… do i just keep taking more amphetamines and caffeine until i can? I exercise, eat well etc etc

I have narcolepsy as well. What really helps a lot is a type of medication called sodium oxybate. Different kinds of stimulants never did anything to me, they might (might) keep me awake more, but I never felt rested, and always had constant brain fog. Xyrem changed that for me. Now I get many hours of good sleep at night, making me feel rested waking up. I'm still more prone to fall asleep during the day than the average person, but it's mostly after I've eaten a big meal. Do yourself a service and look it up.

Re: Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

#49
post #9

This is fascinating. Three years ago, after recovering from COVID, along with many long haul symptoms I developed several similar to but still distinct from narcolepsy. Even now as the CFS-like symptoms have mostly faded, the narcoleptic symptoms are still present. Unfortunately I've not been able to get a positive diagnosis of any sort because it's atypical. There are two main symptoms I experience. First is that, o…

Wow I'm sorry to hear that, but it's also refreshing to hear from someone with a similar experience. > just a more extreme case of the first is a complete inability to wake up. > everything feels so exceptionally tired and heavy that I feel like I don't have the strength to move anything, even to turn my head. I've tried to describe this feeling to others, but it's difficult. I call it my "death sleep," not to be dra…

That's the best guess my family doctor can come to as well. I've not been given a formal diagnosis, but we have proceeded assuming that is the case. Unfortunately that doesn't lead to many options for treatment. Modafinil helped to keep me awake but laying awake through those major episodes was a special kind of hell that I didn't want to live through. Methylphenidate has helped to keep me more alert and capable during the minor episodes, though it doesn't seem to have affected the major episodes. The only other treatment available seems to be Xyrem but it's really expensive and the side effects don't seem worth the risk - there's a very real chance of dying in your sleep. I find it funny that I would be trying to treat an ailment where I'm unable to move or wake up by taking a drug that will ensure I can't move or wake up.

The only other diagnosis that seems plausible is Klein-Levine syndrome. I'm hesitant to believe it's that because it doesn't explain everything and it's quite rare, but the major episodes sound similar and that's a rather unique symptom. I would say I also experience the increased hunger during those episodes. They do tend to last at least a day with periods in between where I will be awake but groggy for a few hours and I'm usually insatiably hungry during those breaks. However, if that's actually what it is, it's even less understood and treatable than idiopathic hypersomnia is, so other than having a name to put to it, it doesn't really help any.

That's why my doctor and I have just kind of left it where it is. We have tried the available treatments for these conditions with some limited success, and otherwise there isn't any benefit to having a formal diagnosis. In fact, the sleep pathologist suggested I may not want to pursue a formal diagnosis because, if diagnosed with something like narcolepsy, I may lose the ability to drive. My symptoms aren't such that I would become incapacitated without warning, but even just putting that name on it could lead to being treated as if that were the case.

Re: Narcolepsy is weird but I didn't notice

#50
> This method is so unreasonably effective I can't believe it works, but it's never failed me yet. Whenever you are in the throws of a cataplectic attack, lying motionless and completely helpless, focus all your energy into "finding" the tip of your index finger (either one will do).

Amazing, this is the exact method I found independently to escape sleep paralysis, which thankfully only happens before or after sleeping for me.

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